Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Motorcycling/Archive 9

This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 5

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Archive 7

Motorcycle auction in Las Vegas

There were records set at the recent Bonham's motorcycle auction in Las Vegas, so several articles could be updated. See [1][2][3][4] etc. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 00:01, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

Talk:Types of motorcycles discussions

There's two discussions that could use more participants at Talk:Types of motorcycles:

--Dennis Bratland (talk) 00:04, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

Hero Motocorp SuperSplendor

I think it's "Super Splendor", with a space. It may be best at Hero Honda Splendor. It may not pass GNG. I know nothing about the subject. Could someone please take some action, if needed, or advise. Thanks, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 11:19, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

Linking to "Motorcycle engine" article

I have gone to articles on engine configurations (e.g. Flat-twin engine, Straight-three engine, etc.) and, on those with sections on "Motorcycle use", I have added "See also" templates with a link to Motorcycle engine under the section heading, with the idea that someone looking for information on the motorcycle applications of a specific engine configuration might also want information on motorcycle engines in general.

My edit at V4 engine#Motorcycle use has been reverted. The discussion of the reversion is at Talk:V4 engine#See also Motorcycle engine - what's wrong with that?.

I would like to know what the consensus is on the general idea of linking sections on "Motorcycle use" in engine configuration articles that have such sections to the "Motorcycle engine" article.

Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 01:05, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

"Indian Scout"

Popular pages tool update

As of January, the popular pages tool has moved from the Toolserver to Wikimedia Tool Labs. The code has changed significantly from the Toolserver version, but users should notice few differences. Please take a moment to look over your project's list for any anomalies, such as pages that you expect to see that are missing or pages that seem to have more views than expected. Note that unlike other tools, this tool aggregates all views from redirects, which means it will typically have higher numbers. (For January 2014 specifically, 35 hours of data is missing from the WMF data, which was approximated from other dates. For most articles, this should yield a more accurate number. However, a few articles, like ones featured on the Main Page, may be off).

Web tools, to replace the ones at tools:~alexz/pop, will become available over the next few weeks at toollabs:popularpages. All of the historical data (back to July 2009 for some projects) has been copied over. The tool to view historical data is currently partially available (assessment data and a few projects may not be available at the moment). The tool to add new projects to the bot's list is also available now (editing the configuration of current projects coming soon). Unlike the previous tool, all changes will be effective immediately. OAuth is used to authenticate users, allowing only regular users to make changes to prevent abuse. A visible history of configuration additions and changes is coming soon. Once tools become fully available, their toolserver versions will redirect to Labs.

If you have any questions, want to report any bugs, or there are any features you would like to see that aren't currently available on the Toolserver tools, see the updated FAQ or contact me on my talk page. Mr.Z-bot (talk) (for Mr.Z-man) 05:17, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Yamaha XT 600

Would someone please review Yamaha XT 600 which needs a talk page with project banner. My concern is some recent edits which broke a {{convert}}. It would be simplest to just revert the edits but what is really needed is someone with an understanding of the topic. Johnuniq (talk) 23:07, 3 March 2014 (UTC)

Merge discussion

A proposal to merge Ariel (vehicle) into Ariel Motorcycles has been made and is to be discussed here: Talk:Ariel Motorcycles#Merger proposal: Ariel (vehicle) into Ariel Motorcycles Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 17:28, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Concept bikes

Is there a category analagous to Category:Concept automobiles that could be used for Suzuki Stratosphere, Dodge Tomahawk, CLEVER, etc.? — Brianhe (talk) 00:59, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

I guess the resounding silence indicated a negative, so I created Category:Concept motorcycles. — Brianhe (talk) 15:15, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Pending edit request

Talk:American Motorcyclist#Edit request --Dennis Bratland (talk) 20:55, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Massimo Tamburini RIP

Massimo Tamburini has died. No full obituaries published yet. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 21:42, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Driver's license

Motrice Pia fringe theory?

Go to Talk:Motrice Pia#Fringe theory? --Dennis Bratland (talk) 14:43, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Template annoyance

Please remove usernames from your template, as used on User talk:Chrisjapan. I'm getting "mention" notifications each time someone posts it. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:37, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Leaflet For Wikiproject Motorcycling At Wikimania 2014

Hi all,

My name is Adi Khajuria and I am helping out with Wikimania 2014 in London.

One of our initiatives is to create leaflets to increase the discoverability of various wikimedia projects, and showcase the breadth of activity within wikimedia. Any kind of project can have a physical paper leaflet designed - for free - as a tool to help recruit new contributors. These leaflets will be printed at Wikimania 2014, and the designs can be re-used in the future at other events and locations.

This is particularly aimed at highlighting less discoverable but successful projects, e.g:

• Active Wikiprojects: Wikiproject Medicine, WikiProject Video Games, Wikiproject Film

• Tech projects/Tools, which may be looking for either users or developers.

• Less known major projects: Wikinews, Wikidata, Wikivoyage, etc.

• Wiki Loves Parliaments, Wiki Loves Monuments, Wiki Loves ____

• Wikimedia thematic organisations, Wikiwomen’s Collaborative, The Signpost

For more information or to sign up for one for your project, go to:
Project leaflets
Adikhajuria (talk) 15:55, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Living people on EN wiki who are dead on other wikis

The following individuals who are in the scope of this project are showing to be alive on the English wiki, but deceased on another language wiki:

Jack Ahearn: de:Gestorben 2012

Please help to find reliable sources to confirm if these individuals are alive or dead, or correct any mis-categorization on the relevant foreign-language article(s). Please see WP:LIVINGDEAD for more info and raise any issues on the talkpage. Thanks. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 08:49, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Moved subsequent conversation to Talk:Jack Ahearn#Living person — Brianhe (talk) 15:46, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Honda SS125A

Here's an old draft that was never submitted at AfC and is now about to be deleted as a stale draft. Is this a notable topic that should be kept and improved instead? —Anne Delong (talk) 06:18, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Where and what? ww2censor (talk) 10:36, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Oops, sorry, I guess I copy-pasted the wrong page name. I've corrected the thread title. Thanks for pointing that out. —Anne Delong (talk) 12:35, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks Anne. It looks like the sole contributor, who also appears to be tyhe anonIP editor, has vanished since July 2012. Does anyone have an actual image of this model (I can't find any free ones) and maybe can improve the draft, so it does not get deleted? ww2censor (talk) 13:26, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

I have postponed its deletion for six months. I can't help, since my knowledge of motorcycles is limited to the number of wheels. —Anne Delong (talk) 13:26, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

motorbiker.org as a potential source

Is Mike Werner's motorbiker.org acceptable as a reliable source? His article on riding in France looks authoritative and the site is long-lived but it might be classified a blog. I wanted to get a second opinion before using it. Here's the specific page in question: [5] -- Brianhe (talk) 15:42, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

Merge discussion for Stella (scooter)

An article that you have been involved in editing, Stella (scooter), has been proposed for a merge with another article. If you are interested in the merge discussion, please participate by going here, and adding your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Brianhe (talk) 17:23, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Stub contest

The annual Wikipedia stub contest is happening for approximately one more week, and several articles of interest to this project are eligible! Here's a list of High-importance ranked stubs:

Cruiser (motorcycle) too long to be eligible for prize
Tom Phillis too long to be eligible for prize
Dougie Lampkin too long to be eligible for prize
Cycle World too long to be eligible for prize
Buffalo Soldiers MC taken
Motrice Pia too long to be eligible for prize
National Bikers Roundup too long to be eligible for prize

Here's links that can generate additional lists: Medium-importance, Low-importance, Unknown Recommend that if you tackle any of the articles listed above, you strike them out when you remove the stub tag (and of course list your accomplishment at Wikipedia:Stub Contest/Entries to win prizes). — Brianhe (talk) 14:27, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

I made it super easy for somebody to expand the Buffalo Soldiers MC stub, by finding and formatting 8 a bunch of new good sources here: Talk:Buffalo Soldiers MC#2014 new sources. — Brianhe (talk) 20:29, 27 September 2014 (UTC)

One day to go! Buffalo Soldiers MC is taken, but there are still plenty of medium- and low-importance stubs to be expanded. — Brianhe (talk) 20:03, 29 September 2014 (UTC)

Comment on the WikiProject X proposal

Hello there! As you may already know, most WikiProjects here on Wikipedia struggle to stay active after they've been founded. I believe there is a lot of potential for WikiProjects to facilitate collaboration across subject areas, so I have submitted a grant proposal with the Wikimedia Foundation for the "WikiProject X" project. WikiProject X will study what makes WikiProjects succeed in retaining editors and then design a prototype WikiProject system that will recruit contributors to WikiProjects and help them run effectively. Please review the proposal here and leave feedback. If you have any questions, you can ask on the proposal page or leave a message on my talk page. Thank you for your time! (Also, sorry about the posting mistake earlier. If someone already moved my message to the talk page, feel free to remove this posting.) Harej (talk) 22:47, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Kawasaki triple

Kawasaki triple is under page protection for edit warring and/or addition of unsourced content. If you can, please use the talk page to offer third opinions, calm things down, and help find a consensus. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 00:46, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

First cross-country trip by electric motorcycle

Inviting project members to contribute at Talk:Terry Hershner#First cross-country trip? There's a potential on this BLP for contribs by COI editors to be overrepresented. Also at least one comment shows that contributors are unfamiliar with the definitional terrain that we've discussed as a group before. — Brianhe (talk) 01:18, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Article for creation

I saw the request for help with Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Honda SS125A at what is now Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Motorcycling/Archive 9#Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Honda SS125A. I have done what I can with this article, including the addition of photos and an infobox, finding another source, and copyediting the article.

Can the article be submitted as it is, or will more work have to be done? Does anyone have access to sources that could improve the article? Is the motorcycle even notable, anyway?

Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 00:57, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

It's not the best motorcycle article but not the worst either. I'd say put it up. — Brianhe (talk) 03:12, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Thank you. I have submitted it. Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 07:43, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Motorcycle show photos

I'm uploading photos to Commons:Category:2014–2015 Seattle International Motorcycle Show. I haven't started categorizing them yet. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 00:43, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Honda CD125TC Benly (1982–1985)

Hello all, I have part drafted an article on the CD125TC 12 hp learner legal commuter from the early 80s. My concern is whether this should be merged with the Honda CD200 RoadMaster article which (briefly) mentions the CD200 Benly of a similar vintage? The 125 was essentially the same as the 200 Benly but with electric start only (no kick), a 4 speed transmission & IIRC different barrels. Perhaps the Roadmaster article could be moved to a new title incorporating the Benlys (& expanded accordingly)? I note there is already a separate article on the Honda CM125 which had similarities with the CD as did the CB125TD Superdream, (no article). Thanks for any help. Eagleash (talk) 20:35, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

"Ghost Rider" mountain

I posted this question originally at the Canada noticeboard, but it got no traction. There is an apparent discrepancy in the description of Mount Hosner as the inspiration for Neil Peart's book title, Ghost Rider. It might actually be another nearby mountain, Three Sisters. Can someone provide clarity at Talk:Mount Hosmer (British Columbia)#Neil Peart and Ghost Rider nickname? — Brianhe (talk) 20:38, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

Motorcycles and motorcycling template

I thought I'd test a general motorcycles and motorcycling template, in the spirit of {{Basketball}} or {{Electricity delivery}}. Here it is.

Feedback and collaboration is invited! It's a draft now and not applied to any articles. I tried to stick to the principle of not duplicating existing templates, especially {{Early motorcycles}} and {{Types of motorcycles}} — Brianhe (talk) 01:03, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

We really need to merge Motorcycle personal protective equipment and Motorcycle armor and place it under Motorcycle clothing (or Motorcycle gear, or Motorcycle kit if we want UK English). Crash protection is only one of the many different purposes of motorcycle clothing, so it belongs in a sub article. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 01:11, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

The armor article looks pretty overblown/intricate detail, which is a hindrance to merging, but I'll be taking a whack at it soon. Does the template look fairly complete? I'd like to move it out of draft space if it passes muster. — Brianhe (talk) 22:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

Expert attention

This is a notice about Category:Motorcycling articles needing expert attention, which might be of interest to your WikiProject. It will take a while before the category is populated. Iceblock (talk) 18:22, 11 December 2014 (UTC)

Moving many articles to WP Motorcycle racing

In order to help clear the 3,000 article assessment backlog, there is a discussion at this project's assessments page to move unassessed articles in certain Speedway categories from WP Motorcycling to WP Motorcycle racing. This will allow the project most interested in the articles to clear the backlog. Comments are welcome there. — Brianhe (talk) 04:51, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject X is live!

Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to Wikipedia:WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Point of View pushing: clubs versus gangs

Where is the right venue for me to raise this Point of View issue regarding the use of the pejorative "gang" relating to motorcycle clubs, even fictional ones?

There are clearly people with an over exaggerated personal agenda about this and I'd like it clarified. Appreciated. --Salty Batter (talk) 00:31, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Motorcycle club, as suggested in reply to you on my talkpage. — Brianhe (talk) 00:34, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Today's featured picture

I just noticed that a Ducati 748 is today's featured picture (on Wikipedia's main page). The article was unreferenced until a moment ago when I added a Cycle World writeup, it needs more help! — Brianhe (talk) 20:00, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

customized bike terms

See my note at Talk:Bobber (motorcycle)#Opinions and attribution. This is relevant to Chopper (motorcycle), as well as cut-down and other customized bikes. I'd like to see us move away from saying opinions about what a true custom bike is are facts. There doesn't seem to be much evidence to support the claims of various pundits in the 2010s about historical custom bike slang. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 21:36, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

No kidding, there aren't even common definitions of top-level motorcycle classifications. Look at the infobox for BMW R1100S—it's in three (out of a total of six!) depending on who's talking. — Brianhe (talk) 23:19, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

The BMW R1100S infobox is now down to two categories! Arrivisto (talk) 20:26, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Uh, I'm not sure it should have been deleted... winning a "best of category" award from a major magazine is significant. Brianhe (talk) 22:51, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

I just double checked: The October 94 CW gave best standard to the R1100GS, not R1100S. It was kind of a stunt selection. They argue that it's not a dirtbike and can't really go off-road, but as a standard on paved roads or well-groomed dirt roads it excelled. In principle though, we can put a bike in 3 or 4 categories if the sources say so. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 23:05, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Whoops, that was in Arrivisto's edit summary and I missed it. Carry on! - Brianhe (talk) 23:23, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Unrestriced 2000 ZX-12R

See User talk:Dennis Bratland#ZX12R. Another IP is claiming there was an unrestricted Kawasaki ZX-12R in 2000, contrary to all the sources cited in that article, List of fastest production motorcycles and Suzuki Hayabusa. I think the IP on my talk page is claiming there were some pre-release prototypes that went faster, which is fine but not really relevant. We can mention that if we ever find a source. But what we really need is any publication which tested a 2000 -- or any other year -- production ZX-12R that went faster than the 300 kph restriction. If anyone can find any old offline sources on this, it would certainly help. It would also help to understand why there seems to be this fanatical belief out on the Kawasaki forums. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 22:41, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

[6] looks to be a potentially reliable piece, and the discussion here certainly suggests that the 2000 bikes were desrestricted. There are sources in List of fastest production motorcycles that need checking out, as they hint that the ZX12R could hit over 300 km/h. Offline sources are definitely needed to verify this. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 01:56, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

The forum link you give is quite typical: some guys on forms say, "yes it was restricted", while other guys reply, "no, it wasn't.". So. I have to ask: what is the use of that? It is typical of what I've seen: some guys are quite fanatical here, but they lack proof.
As far as the story about Muzzy, I've seen posts about it before. It's a deeply weird story. Why did no other publication in the universe respond to Muzzy's quite extraordinary claims? Chief of which is that given the known drag coefficient of the ZX-12R, and the horsepower of the stock bike, 192&mph is simply absurd. All I can guess is that Cycle Canada and Cycle World and Motor Cycle News simply laughed and ignored muzzy.
I want to be open minded here but I also would like to know why the evidence being offered is so weak. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 02:13, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

I think the reason it is weak is potentially quite simple; Kawasaki didn't want to be the ones who got superbikes banned, so they kept the ZX-12R out of press hands as much as possible (this is my own speculation, but others have come up with that theory as well). From what I can see, the British publication Fast Bikes covered the ZX-12R in their June 2000 issue (based on [7]), so that is a source worth digging out if someone has it. It was definitely limited for 2001 onwards; [8] has some scans of a magazine that specifically went and derestricted both the Hayabusa and the ZX-12R that year, and they claim to have clocked an unrestricted ZX-12R at 190, so 192 may actually be possible. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 02:23, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

"The latest spin on Kawasaki's ZX-12R" by Mark Hoyer in Cycle World, November 2000 on p. 60 confirms Muzzy's story! With the caveat that the bike as shipped might not have had the cam timing set to factory spec, and that Muzzy found a 6.9 hp gain by adjusting the bike to spec. But aside from that, Hoyer says Cycle World achieved 183.5 mph against the wind, and 190.4 mph with a tailwind, meaning that the bike had to be unrestricted. Hoyer also wrote that "next year" i.e. 2001, there will be a speed limit. In The Ultimate History of Fast Bikes, Roland Brown coyly alludes to "confusion" over the ZX-12R's top speed, but I think we can cite Hoyer's words as meeting Wikipedia's standards. I only wish one of these guys had cited a source long ago instead of just throwing fits. That said, we should still try to get a copy of Fast Bikes June 2000. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 02:48, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

In fairness to them, it's probably something that they'd been involved in many discussions about over the years, so they were convinced they were right, but they'd never actually seen a source for it (or had forgotten where the information originally came from). Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 12:32, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

List of named corners of the Snaefell Mountain Course

A recent editor has included a named List of named corners of the Snaefell Mountain Course for the road, straights and corners which are part of the Snaefell Mountain Course used for the Isle of Man TT and Manx Grand Prix. The list article duplicates a template list of articles Template:Mountain_Course which lists the Snaefell Mountain Corners in the order they appear on the course. There issues in the Talk Pages that an experienced editor that has created the List of named corners of the Snaefell Mountain Course has insufficient technical background knowledge, insufficient access to sources and created problems of sufficient quality for the list article to be considered as an encyclopaedic article on Wikipedia. There are also further issues of duplicating information, ridiculous and nonsensical description, issues of notability and related articles of the Isle of Man TT network being subjected to retrospective AfD nominations without first referring to the AfD process. These problems have completed stopped the development further of the Isle of Man TT network of articles. Also, there is problems with an US based editor repeatedly listing and duplicating the fatal accidents to competitors, confusing roadside memorials with commemorative plaques and not listing the roadside memorials on public roads of non-competitor fatal accidents. I have raised the issue with Wikipdeia Teahouse which suggested comments from WikiProject Motorcycling. Thanks ! agljones(talk)11:49, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

I suggest that you proceed to edit the list article to improve it, based on what the highest quality reliable sources say about these matters. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 02:02, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Indian Chief

The primary topic of "Indian Chief" is under discussion, see Talk:Indian Chief (motorcycle) -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 05:02, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

New project navigation header

The WikiProject Trains has a neat navigation header that I modified for our use. A mockup of what this would look like on the project homepage is here: New headers workpage and on the Italian motorcycles SIG subpage. If feedback is positive we can adopt this the homepage layout and use the navigation header on project sub-pages. — Brianhe (talk) 17:50, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

"Indian" (motorcycle)

The naming and scope of Indian (motorcycle) is under discussion, see talk:Indian (motorcycle) -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 05:00, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

Rolling Thunder rally

More eyes would be appreciated at Rolling Thunder (organization). This gets attention from new editors about this time every year as preparations for the rally are underway. I recently moved criticism in The Economist from the lede to a subsection as a response to its deletion by an anon editor. — Brianhe (talk) 19:16, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Citation style

Hi! Firstly sorry if this is not the appropriate place to ask. I'm currently working on the Honda CB400F page but I wondered which style of citation the project recommends to use? I have found that on my last two pages that I worked on I have used the same magazine, for several references, over several pages, even though it is actually only the one article. The sfn template looks like it would useful to tidy references up on the page but it looks harder to work with and could lead to different styles being used. Any help is appreciated. Thanks MAbbey (talk) 19:58, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

We don't have any preference in the Motorcycling Project, since there's nothing particular about bike articles that makes us favor one style over another. You just want to try to be consistent within an article, so if you change the style of one cite then change all the rest too. WP:CITE, Help:Footnotes etc have instructions on what your options are. Remember that the only important goal is verifiability, so never let style stand in the way of making it possible -- no matter how -- for others to verify a fact. If you meet that goal, then it's good enough to keep, and later on somebody can always come along and fix up the style. If the style and formatting is perfect but there's insufficient information to actually verify a fact, then it can't be fixed without repeating all the work.

Personal I prefer list-defined references because it's easier to find and sort the references, and it avoids the problem of a full citation being in the infobox, and things like that. If you re-edit move a paragraph, you don't have to change the order of the citations to clean it up; they're all grouped in one place. @Brianhe: likes to use shortened footnotes, which is a more elaborate way of presenting footnotes. It helps the reader see a clean list of references grouped in alphabetical order.

Template:Rp is also helpful, if you one work (usually a big book like the Art of the Motorcycle Catalog) that you cite many times, you move the page number outside your <ref></ref> tags. There's lots of ways of doing it, and they're all good. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 21:21, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

Either list-defined references or shortened footnotes (sfn) works great, but it's good to try not to mix the styles in the same article. Sometimes I end up doing it anyway because it is cumbersome to use sfn to refer to a source with no known author or no known date. One big advantage of sfn is the appearance with multiple cites to the same work, but different page numbers. Usually this only matters with academic-ish sources. — Brianhe (talk) 21:26, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

Thank you as ever for being a fountain of knowledge. I have only been using inline citations because that is what were already used in the articles I have been editing so far. As someone who has worked with html, vb and Harvard refs before I just found the inline cite method effective but cumbersome. I believe inline cites are the easiest to get to grips with and most likely to get novices adding refs. I'll start to use the Template:Rp from now on, it complements both the inline and list defined. It also gives scope to move to sfn in the future. Thanks. MAbbey (talk) 08:52, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

Created a draft article but unsure where to go?

Hello, I have created a draft article on the ComStar wheel that Honda used during the late seventies to the early eighties. Could I ask for someone to give it a quick look over please?

I'm unsure what categories to use, I don't really understand how that works.
Also if it is ready to move, is it just a case of moving it into namespace?
Is the title ok?

Sorry for all of the questions but I would rather err on the side of caution and ask the more experienced amongst me. Thanks MAbbey (talk) 17:17, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Hello and welcome. I'm sure there are a couple of project members who can help bring this to articlehood. At first glance it looks well referenced to me. You might look at Motorcycle components for some category ideas. Why don't you wait for a bit and somebody will probably move this within 1-2 days. Brianhe (talk) 19:45, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Question, were any of the media sources online? I understand if you used magazine hardcopies, and that's not a problem. — Brianhe (talk) 20:46, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

I tend to use period magazine articles, usually from the collection I gathered whilst restoring my old Honda CB400N. Occasionally I have used scans of old magazine articles for references. I'm unsure on how the potential copyright issues work with these. An example would be on David Silver Spares website . I can only assume that in return for being featured in an article the magazine has agreed for them to keep a copy of the article available to the public?! For these I have used the cite journal template as if they were hard copies but not listed the url of the source. I wouldn't want to get people into trouble or flood them with traffic either. MAbbey (talk) 09:33, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

I also think it's OK to go as is...my only doubt was possibly notability but as @Brianhe: hasn't raised that as an issue, then seems fair enough. You could simply move it into mainspace yourself: you may (or may not) wish to add the review tag at very top and also begin the talk page. Eagleash (talk) 22:58, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

The draft was looking pretty good so I moved it to Comstar wheel today. — Brianhe (talk) 19:34, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Excellent news! Thank you @Brianhe: it has been an honour and pleasure collaborating with you. The article would be no where near what it is now without your support. MAbbey (talk) 19:47, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

The collaboration is going so well I'd like to start on a more complete article on wheels. A beginning is at Draft:Motorcycle wheels. — Brianhe (talk) 21:24, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Draft is shaping up nicely, I think it will be ready to move to article space with the addition of a summarizing lede, and optional addition of some text on brake–wheel integration covering discs and drums. — Brianhe (talk) 04:03, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

MT-09 vs FZ-09

Please help a new editor with the article title. Head on over to Talk:Yamaha MT-09#MT-09 vs FZ-09 discuss. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 15:30, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

I see that the same user has changed the Yamaha MT-07 page with exactly the same edit summary as the Yamaha MT-09 edit. I do not feel confident enough to revert it myself though. MAbbey (talk) 19:06, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Motorcycling/Conventions

Wikipedia:WikiProject Motorcycling/Conventions has gone live and is undergoing a lot of changes. Please comment, or edit, if you see anything that doesn't look right. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 19:02, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Looks great! It will be useful to have a guideline to work to. For the Engines section could we clarify how it would be best to get the information down? At the moment it looks like it still has legacy from its car roots. Motorcycles don't tend to have engine families. It is one thing I have found difficult to get across in the infobox. Take a litre sports bike for example. I would write

998 cc (60.9 cu in) dohc 16 valve liquid cooled inline-four
Coded as:

{{convert|998|cc|abbr=on}} [[dohc]] 16 [[Poppet valve|valve]] [[Radiator (engine cooling)|liquid cooled]] [[inline-four]]

Any thoughts on this? MAbbey (talk) 19:30, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

Yes, that's good. Though usually in the past we have linked to Multivalve for the valves part; we lack articles on 3-valve/cyl and 4-valve/cyl, which is what we really want. We do have articles on Flathead engine, IOE engine and Overhead valve engine, so we have something to link to there.

There are still several sections that are just copied over from WP:WPAC. Go right ahead and revise where necessary. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 20:12, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

Yamaha Tesseract

Please see discussion at Talk:Yamaha Tesseract#Patents. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 15:12, 11 July 2015 (UTC)

Flickr image

What is this and do we need it? https://www.flickr.com/photos/119886413@N05/15482771608 I don't know the make. ww2censor (talk) 17:59, 4 August 2015 (UTC)

Don't know, but I'm glad to see other people mine Flickr for images! Brianhe (talk) 18:12, 4 August 2015 (UTC)

This Flickr user also has several other motorcycle image mainly from museums. ww2censor (talk) 18:22, 4 August 2015 (UTC)

I got some help from the old motorcycles group on Facebook. It's a Hercules S 125, (1938-43), 125 cm³, 3,5 PS, 3-Gänge according to [9]; they have this photo, more examples at Google Images. We could certainly use this. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 14:51, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

Great detective work. I was going to add that the engine (or trans?) cover seemed to say "Sachs" implying German manufacture, not that it would have helped a whole lot. — Brianhe (talk) 16:26, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

I've listed about 60 motorcycle images by this Flickr user's in a sandbox at User:Ww2censor/Sandbox but don't have the time to upload them myself. You are welcome to upload them but please strick through the link so others know what has been uploaded here or is still available once you upload them here. He also has hundreds of freely licenced image of cars. ww2censor (talk) 23:24, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

Second opinion on Draft:Geoff Hill

Could I get a second opinion on whether Draft:Geoff Hill is ready to go? I rescued it as a declined AfC and think it has been expanded with all I can find. Looks as good as most of our MC journalist and LDR articles. - Brianhe (talk) 14:18, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

Seasonality trends

This should have occurred to me before, but I just noticed using this tool the striking seasonality of pageviews. The link is to Suzuki Hayabusa but it seems to hold for other motorcycle articles as well e.g. CBR600 for summer 2013. Even Motorcycle shows a pronounced drop-off around the December holidays every year since 2009. Something to consider if we're planning new editor recruiting, an article improvement drive, or such. — Brianhe (talk) 18:00, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

New motorcycle images

in the last few days I uploaded several hundred Flickr motorcycle images. Unfortunately one album of about 270 images were very badly named and categorised, so they will need to have the descriptions and categories checked as well as being renamed to something that makes sense. Their title contains just the name "Quail Motorcycle Gathering 2015" and a Flickr ref number. You can find them easiest by looking through my upload list and are in my Oct 1 uploads. As this was my first time using the mass upload feature of Flickr2commoms I did not realise that every image in such circumstances should to renamed and have the cats redefined; a thankless task during upload preparation. If you do not have commons image mover rights, just tag them for renaming based on the photo. Some could probably do with being cropped but most are high resolution images. In some instances I don't even know the bikes in question and the Flickr user did not help, so any edits on that front will be appreciated. Thanks for helping. ww2censor (talk) 08:59, 3 October 2015 (UTC)

Reliable sources discussion

Please comment in the discussion at Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard#zeroto60times.com. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 23:27, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

article name: Tricycle or Autorickshaw?

The naming of Tricycle Autorickshaws is under discussion, see talk:Auto rickshaw (Philippines) -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 08:58, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

A category for belt-drive motorcycles?

There's a discussion here that may interest members of this project. DexDor^(talk) 19:34, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

Motorcycle racing portal

Due to several years of inactivity I've tagged the Portal:Motorcycle racing as needing updating. Portals with no update or talk page activity for 4 months are considered inactive. There have been no update to the news section since 2008 and the current Moto GP standings have not been updated since 2013. If someone want to take it on and continue to update the portal with content, please do so and remove the inactive tag. ww2censor (talk) 22:25, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

RfC on Motorcycling Conventions

There is a new RfC on Motorcycling Conventions. Please join the discussion there. Thank you. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 20:21, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Project classes

I wonder if there's interest in the project adding Draft, Template, Category, Redirect and other classes. Currently, all those articles (including draftspace ones) are all stored in Category:NA-Class Motorcycling articles together which is over 1200 pages. It would be easier to find drafts and other useful pages if separated. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 19:53, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Now that you mention it, I just always assumed the category structure was mandatory. Something established Wikipedia-wide that we can't change if we want to use the article class system. But I agree, breaking these up into specific categories would be a good idea, if it's possible. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 20:06, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

I don't recall where the discussion is but Draft articles don't appear in the project assessment table as such. If you select the 3 items that are quality/importance NA / ??? you get this result and if you add the text Draft: as a prefix to the article name, the draft article is then revealed. For some reason the assessment tool cannot properly deal with Draft articles but I don't recall why. I think most of the NA / NA listings are categories and redirects (many or maybe most don't actually have a redirect code on the talk page where the assessment banner is), and I'm not sure they can be separated out either. Personally I think assessing a redirect is pointless to any project and it is certainly of no use if it does not actually redirect. If you look at User:WP 1.0 bot/Tables/Project/Ireland you will see more separate classes than we have and there the drafts are listed under Other / ???. Which ones would you like to see? I'll ask someone who might know. ww2censor (talk) 23:06, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Help with an article?

Can someone help with the article 1979 AMA National Speedway Championship? I'm not familiar with these types of events and it looks like this should fall under these guidelines. The article has no sourcing and was made by a new editor, so I'm not sure if they know exactly where to look for sourcing. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 02:54, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Tokyogirl79 - I'm not sure I'd call that an article - it's not even a stub. It appears somebody simply created that page using the name of the event. See the following list: AMA_National_Speedway_Championship. If you want to expand it into an article, use Google search. Atsme^📞📧 03:37, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

I'm really not the best person to edit the article or look for sourcing, since I have no idea what I'd be looking for beyond lengthy news articles. A quick search brought up nothing that I'd recognize as a reliable, notability-establishing source. I came across this via another editor that's eyeing it up for deletion and offhand my first inclination is that it should be deleted, since it doesn't really make sense as a redirect since the main article is pretty slim itself on details. I just figured that it'd be a good idea to let people know here rather than just telling the editor to just take it straight to AfD, since people familiar with the sport and event would be more likely to know where to look for sourcing and what would be considered reliable. I don't really have any interest in expanding the article, so this was just a good faith notification before someone potentially takes it to AfD. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 07:24, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

I don't mean that to sound harsh, just that I'm not going to be expanding it. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 07:25, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

I was going to call the top editor on Motorcycle speedway but it turns out he's either blocked or banned. The rest of the top 5 editors haven't visited Wikipedia for ~9 years. I'm unaware of any active project members who are active in Speedway topics and it really isn't my thing or I'd help out myself. – Brianhe (talk) 08:20, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

It's a list item at this point, at least until some energetic speedway enthusiast wants to invest the time making it worthy of being a separate article which can be done at any time from the list, provided something notable took place during the race other than the finish line announcement of a winner and prizes won. Atsme^📞📧 12:40, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

Redirect to list is an option, but there is arguably very little worth keeping in the history. I'd guess the newbie had a connection, back in the day.--Rocknrollmancer (talk) 13:14, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

Long track naming

Hi guys. I've come across a CfD from 2011 deleting Category:2011 in long track which effectively puts the whole of the Category:long track hierarchy in limbo. I've started a centralized discussion over at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Sports#Long_track_sports to try and resolve it, I invite your thoughts over there.Le Deluge (talk) 16:16, 12 March 2016 (UTC)

In the absence of any progress on the article name, I've put the category hierarchy up for renaming at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2016 March 31 Le Deluge (talk) 00:16, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

"Dodge Tomahawk"

"UTV, ATV, and off-road vehicles"

May I request a set of resources related to the topics? Anyone out there has list of websites that feature news or update about motor companies? Thank you and God speed. Theahaiku (talk) 01:03, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Can we include ATV and UTV industry? I dunno if they are considered as motorcycles though. I just observed that there are a few articles about them. Theahaiku (talk) 00:11, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

New ACE motorcycles

FYI There are brand-new "ACE Motorcycles" (400cc single) being sold here in Kathmandu, Nepal. They claim to be British bikes - but I understand they are assembled in Taiwan or China. I put a photograph I took of one of these bikes on Commons File:ACE 400cc motorcycle Kathmandu.jpg. Posting this here as there is no information about these bikes on Wikipedia. See also:http://classicwheels.com.np/british-ace-home/
-Chris Fynn (talk) 13:02, 6 May 2016 (UTC) Chris Fynn (talk) 13:02, 6 May 2016 (UTC)

Rider?

Hey folks. As part of a DYK nomination, some editors have questioned whether Rider is a reliable source. I'd appreciate any comments you could make weighing in at Template:Did you know nominations/Danell Lynn. ~ Rob^Talk 01:27, 28 May 2016 (UTC)

Yes, it's generally considered reliable. I'll comment over there. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 03:03, 28 May 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for commenting, Dennis. Since you mentioned awards there, I'd say for future reference that Iron Butt Awards alone shouldn't be considered as conferring notability; just too many people are awarded them. It could be problematic e.g. for List of long-distance motorcycle riders if that were allowed. - Brianhe (talk) 01:38, 29 May 2016 (UTC)

Yes, that award alone doesn't meet GNG. I was jst thinking that the 2-3 very short feature articles were only just barely enough to establish notability. With that alone, you could forgive anyone for saying the subject isn't notable enough; it could go either way. So if you add to that the Guinness and other awards, and the previous media coverage, it pushes the notability a bit past that very edge and into more solid territory. Usually we prefer to see around 3 very solid sources, but it's also possible, though not idea, to be notable by combining several sources that on their own wouldn't meet the standard.

I do think we're listing too many long distance riders and should perhaps look for a way to raise the bar. The early pioneering riders had pretty interesting stories. Now they're getting rather generic, following a well-worn path, and are about as interesting as the hundreds of people who climb Mt. Everest every year. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 04:34, 29 May 2016 (UTC)

Auto-assessment of article classes

Following a recent discussion at WP:VPR, there is consensus for an opt-in bot task that automatically assesses the class of articles based on classes listed for other project templates on the same page. In other words, if WikiProject A has evaluated an article to be C-class and WikiProject B hasn't evaluated the article at all, such a bot task would automatically evaluate the article as C-class for WikiProject B.

If you think auto-assessment might benefit this project, consider discussing it with other members here. For more information or to request an auto-assessment run, please visit User:BU RoBOT/autoassess. This is a one-time message to alert projects with over 1,000 unassessed articles to this possibility. ~ Rob^Talk 01:16, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Skully

It would be appreciated if more editors would keep an eye on Skully (helmet). It seems to be attracting a lot of edits that are not up to this project's quality standards for sourcing. I'm going to take a break from it for a bit to avoid the appearance of WP:OWN. - Brianhe (talk) 22:23, 18 July 2016 (UTC)

Identification

Can anyone identify the motorcycle on the right of this image? File:The people's war book; history, cyclopaedia and chronology of the great world war (1919) (14778712601).jpg If so please add that category to the image. Thanks ww2censor (talk) 14:30, 1 October 2016 (UTC)

Here's the original context. No info in caption. I don't think it's a Douglas or Triumph. --Dennis Bratland (talk) 18:21, 1 October 2016 (UTC)

It's a Sunbeam - I've added the cat. Several things weird going on in that image - what looks chain drive to a rear brake drum/sprocket with a rigid rod actuation by a rocking, organ-pedal footboard, all with a belt-drive pulley or faux-rim brake on the other side. Don't think it's changeable hub-gear ratios? Looks a bit too slim and flimsy for that. I'll add it to me list.--Rocknrollmancer (talk) 23:32, 9 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks, I knew there would be some more knowledgeable editors around. ww2censor (talk) 23:20, 10 October 2016 (UTC)

VTR1000F

I have been looking at the Honda VTR1000F page and I feel the page needs to progress. I've made a few edits , but most of them were instantly reverted. It would be good for other biker Wikipedians to have their input; so, if you have a moment, why not take a look at the page and see what you could add? Arrivisto (talk) 17:14, 23 November 2016 (UTC)

2016 Community Wishlist Survey Proposal to Revive Popular Pages

Greetings WikiProject Motorcycling/Archive 9 Members!

This is a one-time-only message to inform you about a technical proposal to revive your Popular Pages list in the 2016 Community Wishlist Survey that I think you may be interested in reviewing and perhaps even voting for:

Fix and improve Mr.Z-bot's popular pages report

If the above proposal gets in the Top 10 based on the votes, there is a high likelihood of this bot being restored so your project will again see monthly updates of popular pages.

Further, there are over 260 proposals in all to review and vote for, across many aspects of wikis.

Thank you for your consideration. Please note that voting for proposals continues through December 12, 2016.

Best regards, Stevietheman — Delivered: 18:04, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Engineering Design (Calculations) of Motorcycles Page

I wonder if we can have a page dedicated to desing of two wheelers, The engineering design part, on Calculations & other design parameters. Am an Automotive engineer myself and believe will help the ton of people innovating in the personal mobility space. Crank2giri (talk) 14:38, 4 February 2017 (UTC)Giridhar

Popular pages report

We – Community Tech – are happy to announce that the Popular pages bot is back up-and-running (after a one year hiatus)! You're receiving this message because your WikiProject or task force is signed up to receive the popular pages report. Every month, Community Tech bot will post at Wikipedia:WikiProject Motorcycling/Archive 9/Popular pages with a list of the most-viewed pages over the previous month that are within the scope of WikiProject Motorcycling.

We've made some enhancements to the original report. Here's what's new:

The pageview data includes both desktop and mobile data.
The report will include a link to the pageviews tool for each article, to dig deeper into any surprises or anomalies.
The report will include the total pageviews for the entire project (including redirects).

We're grateful to Mr.Z-man for his original Mr.Z-bot, and we wish his bot a happy robot retirement. Just as before, we hope the popular pages reports will aid you in understanding the reach of WikiProject Motorcycling, and what articles may be deserving of more attention. If you have any questions or concerns please contact us at m:User talk:Community Tech bot.

Warm regards, the Community Tech Team 17:16, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

"Bike" Defined In Every Dictionary Including A Google Search As A Motorcycle, But Wikipedia Redirects To Bicycle?

Hi,

I am a motorcycle (bike) enthusiast, which is a $120 billion global market, who would like Wikipedia to show some respect to the motorcycle industry and the definition of the term "bike" by redirecting people who search the term "bike" to the motorcycle page or asking Wikipedia to properly create an article for "bike" for motorcycle and bicycle enthusiasts alike. With all due respect, it is currently a slap to the face of the motorcycle industry redirecting the term "bike" searches by individuals to the "bicycle" article with just a hat note for the "motorcycle" article. A simple Google search of "define bike" or in any dictionary, will show that the term "bike" is commonly referred to and interchangeably used to describe a "motorcycle" and/or "bicycle".

In addition, for current affairs, Progressive Motorcycle Insurance is airing a television commercial where the motorcyclist refers to his bike as a bike:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC82qj30VAg

NOTICE: Between seconds 8 and 9 of this nationally televised 2017 TV commercial the gentleman states "..best BIKE I ever owned!" referencing the motorcycle he is riding, not a bicycle.

Currently, it is quite unfair to motorcycle enthusiasts and the motorcycle community to disrespect the nickname "bike" by going directly to "bicycle" because the term "bike" is used to describe a motorcycle just as much as it is described to be a bicycle. There really ought to be a separate article for "bike" since a bicycle and a motorcycle are not the same thing.

As a motorcycle enthusiast, I hope you can understand my frustration in searching the term "bike" and being redirected to "bicycle" with a minor hat note for motorcycle enthusiasts when every dictionary including a simple google search of "define bike" all define the term to be interchangeable between motorcycle and bicycle. The definition of a term is the most valid evidence an encyclopedia could have at its disposal for an article. And I want to believe Wikipedia is a trusted encyclopedia, but currently it is not doing justice towards the definition of the word "bike."

Thanks and I hope the Wikipedia volunteer team can rectify this issue. :)

With Warmest Regards,

Christopher2600:8805:4200:204:58FC:4084:C80D:278C (talk) 14:37, 13 May 2017 (UTC)

Hey, Christopher. Your words above although well-considered will probably cause a little bit of controversy with the bicycle community on Wikipedia. It would probably be best to make this request where both communities can see it. Or at least to put on the bicycles project page (WikiProject Cycling, uh-oh) a note that the discussion is here. We generally have a policy of not changing things unless there is consensus to do so.

Also note that "we were there first" is likely to degenerate quickly. E.g. Bike Magazine is either about motorcycles or about mountain bikes. - Bri (talk) 21:44, 13 May 2017 (UTC)

Perhaps you don't realise that bicycles and the term bike were in use before motorcycles were invented. See: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bike Also if you are redirected to bicycle when you search bike there is a clear hatnote that points you to Bike (disambiguation) where motorcycle is listed. The fact is that the term is used for both modes of transport and no disrespect to motorcyclists is intended but bike meaning bicycle is older than bike meaning motorcycle, so I doubt you will ever get a consensus to reverse the current situation. BTW, just as one example of the older use of bike for bicycle, here is a Library of Congress search of their image archive for the term "bike" and there is not even 1 motorcycle to be seen in the results. ww2censor (talk) 22:36, 13 May 2017 (UTC)

To Whom It May Concern:

If Wikipedia wants to be considered a factual encyclopedia, then there really should be a separate article for the term "BIKE" showing the interchangeability of the term with every dictionary showing a "BIKE" is just as much a motorcycle as it is a bicycle. Again, last night I was watching television and saw two more commercials showing the relevance of the term "BIKE" being a motorcycle not a bicycle in today's society. Here are all three TV commercials I have seen from Allstate and Progressive Insurance companies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ema5Qj0Qr9Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUOScQy9tTc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC82qj30VAg

If a motorcycle enthusiast searches the term "BIKE" on Wikipedia, it is unfactual for an encyclopedia to lead them to a bicycle article when it truthfully should lead them to an article that shows both motorcycles and bicycles.

Thanks and I hope the Wikipedia volunteer team can rectify this issue because it is quite disrespectful to the motorcycle community and we all want to truly believe Wikipedia is a truthful source for information of all terminology. :)

With Warmest Regards,

Christopher

Wikipedia is not a dictionary. Wikipedia is also written for a reasonably educated audience, meaning they should be familiar with basic English words like bike and motorcycle. A different encyclopedia, Simple English Wikipedia is there for those with limited language ability. You should also realize that you could go to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cycling and they would make exactly the same argument, except with all the words bike and motorcycle changing places. You're welcome to go to the bicycling project and see what they have to say. Dennis Bratland (talk) 15:10, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

Dennis Wikipedia does not need to be a dictionary to realize the term "BIKE" is the term used to describe motorcycles in current affairs (TV, Radio, Magazine, etc. commercial advertisements) per examples already provided to you. Why so much disrespect to the facts provided, versus fixing the issue. When a motorcycle enthusiast searches the term "BIKE", as proven in current and past affairs, and in every English dictionary, they should see an article showing motorcycles and bicycles? I'm saddened to see an encyclopedia disrespecting motorcycle enthusiasts without an article on "BIKE" ? Instead of all of this disrespectful excuses, please just follow the truth and facts of the matter. The truth and facts of the matter is that when someone searches the term "BIKE" they should see an article on how the term is used interchangeably for motorcycles and bicycles. I'm not saying Wikipedia is a dictionary, but I have shown you evidence of how the term is used to describe motorcycles in current affairs plus any and every dictionary.

With Warmest Regards,

Christopher — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.225.35.60 (talk) 13:33, 1 June 2017 (UTC)

v t e Motorcycles and Motorcycling (outline)
General topics	Definition History Museums Motorcycle occupations Safety
Types	Street Cruiser Sport Touring / Sport touring Universal Japanese Motorcycle Custom Dual-sport Off-road Enduro Motocross Track racing Trials
Design	Components Accessories Brakes Chassis Frame Suspension Fork Engine Transmission Saddle Tires (tyres) Wheels Fairing Testing and measurement
Manufacturers	Bajaj BMW Ducati Harley-Davidson Hero Japanese Big Four Honda Kawasaki Suzuki Yamaha KTM Kymco Peugeot Piaggio Aprilia Moto Guzzi Royal Enfield Triumph TVS VinFast Zero
Media	Books Biker films Magazines
Touring	Motorcycle rally List of long-distance motorcycle riders
Equipment	Armor Boots Helmet Jacket
Sport	Motorcycle land-speed record Production motorcycles (by speed / by acceleration) Freestyle motocross Racing Stunting Trials
Organizations	Motorcycle club List of motorcycle clubs Motorcycle gang Colors List of outlaw motorcycle clubs