Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Star Trek: The Next Generation cast members/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Giants2008 10:02, 25 March 2013 (UTC) [1].[reply]

List of Star Trek: The Next Generation cast members[edit]

List of Star Trek: The Next Generation cast members (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): Miyagawa (talk) 15:15, 3 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I've worked this one up based on the FL List of Grey's Anatomy cast members article. The information in the tables themselves are based on one of the annexes in the Nemecek general reference, which included a list of all guest characters in the show. This article includes any actors who appeared in the same role more than once - I have plans on a separate article of guest stars which includes those actors who appeared only once. Miyagawa (talk) 15:15, 3 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Crisco 1492 (talk)
*Comments from Crisco 1492
"re-tread characters in the same vein as the original series" - Not quite clear on this
Reworded it to make it clearer. The specific phrasing Roddenberry used was "re-tread" which I tried to work in, but isn't as helpful as it could be. To be precise, he was trying to avoid casting new parts in familar roles. For example, a different Vulcan science officer (in fact he tried to avoid the old style Trek so completly that he initially banned Vulcans, Klingons and Romulans, although they all appeared before the end of the first season). Miyagawa (talk) 23:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
an American television science fiction - Missing a word
Completed jumbled it in fact. Fixed it now to the standard wording used in some recent GAs. Miyagawa (talk) 23:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
During casting, the role of Troi was originally assigned to Denise Crosby, with Marina Sirtis cast as Security Chief Macha Hernandez, but Roddenberry thought that Sirtis would be better in the role of Troi and switched the two actresses, changing Hernandez back into an earlier version of the security chief, called Tasha Yar. - Too many clauses
Split into two sentences with a slight alteration. Miyagawa (talk) 23:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Make sure this article uses American English, as it's an American subject. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:12, 4 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Always a difficult one for me as I'm a British English writer. I can spot the usual suspects like color etc, but I think my darn browser spell checks it into British English instead of American. Miyagawa (talk) 23:41, 4 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Happy to take your word for it. I didn't even know American English only used a single "L" there! :) I must work out how to make my browser spell check in American English instead of British. Miyagawa (talk) 10:03, 5 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • That wasn't me, you might want to double check. (don't think I've actually seen any of the films, although to be honest I was always a Voyager fan) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:25, 5 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Managed to post that comment under the wrong bullet point (should have been the one above - I'm on fire here!). But yes, Barclay was in First Contact, I entered the ones I knew (well, thought I knew) first when I was formatting the table initially and then double checked them against the source. Apparently I didn't double check that row hard enough. The majority of the entrants in the table were taken from the source directly as I only used about ten rows to test layouts etc. Miyagawa (talk) 14:12, 5 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support on prose. Single image, fair use, looks acceptable. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 14:27, 5 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Looks good all around. You have a couple of redirects that don't look intentional- Georgia Brown, Jonathan del Arco, Executive Producer, Paramount Studios, but nothing major. Also, consider archiving your online references with web.archive.org or webcitation.com, so that changes in the websites don't leave your statements unsupported. --PresN 19:31, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. Generally looks good. A few comments on the lead... It would be interesting to discuss Patrick Stewart's casting as the captain; this received considerable discussion, as I recall. Would it be possible to discuss briefly a few more of the major recurring actors (I'm thinking mainly of Majel Barrett, John de Lancie, Colm Meaney, Whoopi Goldberg, who are probably more strongly associated with the series than Diana Muldaur)? Is it worth mentioning that some actors reprised their roles on DS9? In the lists, what is the ordering? The main cast could be credits order, though I thought McFadden went earlier, but I'm foxed on much of the recurring cast. Could the tables be made sortable, at least on the first two columns (though a case could be made for being able to sort on seasons too). Are all the red-linked actors notable? Espresso Addict (talk) 23:20, 11 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • It shouldn't be too hard to add more information, certainly the Stewart casting is interesting as Roddenberry wanted someone else originally but the other producers brought him around. Frakes was originally the second choice for Riker, but the first choice bombed in casting sessions, and so he got the job instead. I haven't got a great deal on Colm Meaney, and all of my John de Lancie casting information is already in the Encounter at Farpoint article. The Whoopi Goldberg one is good though because she literally asked for a part, so they wrote her one. I can certainly add a paragraph about the other major casting points. I've added sorting to the tables although I thought I'd best explain the order - basically the first appearance/majority is the initial order, so in this case, Gates McFadden fell down the list because she didn't appear in the second season. Otherwise, Denise Crosby moves much further up the list as does Wil Wheaton and the initial listing looks a bit messy. The second table's sort needs some explanation, as I've sorted some parts differently. So for instance Colm Meaney's character column sorts to "O'Brien, Miles" despite it having "Conn Ensign" listed first - as the role of O'Brien was the primary one. Also, Ro Laren is sorted to "Ro Laren" and not "Laren, Ro" as "Ro" is the family name (hence the episode title "Ensign Ro". I'll leave a note here when I've added the other casting information. Miyagawa (talk) 11:30, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • I don't know anything more about de Lancie's casting, though there might possibly be something in Roddenbury's authorised biography Star Trek Creator by David Alexander (which reportedly discusses that Q was named for a fan called Janet Quarton). Memory Alpha says he worked with Spiner on The Twilight Zone immediately before TNG, which might be worth following up.[2] Thanks for the sorting. It's probably better to custom sort to get Starring > Recurring > Guest > —. I take your point on the default position of McFadden, but then for consistency shouldn't the default order of the recurring/guest characters also be sorted on total number of appearances (eg Meaney should probably be second after Barrett)? I agree that the most logical route is to sort characters on family name of the most prominent part they played, so perhaps Suzie Plakson should sort under K'Ehleyr? (And weren't all of Meaney's appearances as O'Brien, even if the character wasn't named until later?) And on the O'Brien family, shouldn't Keiko be given her maiden name of Ishikawa too, as she appeared before her marriage? Espresso Addict (talk) 16:10, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'll go through and get the Starring/Recurring/Guest sorting out correctly. I was wondering about Plakson as it was two appearences versus one. I'd say to leave Keiko as O'Brien rather than her maiden name as she's better known as that (and her wiki entry is under that too). As for Miles, well it's been a point of discussion ever since they did it, but I go with the view that he probably played at least two distinct characters due to the ranks. In "Encounter at Farpoint" he was an Ensign in the command branch, and then in "Lonely Among Us" he was a security officer in the security/operations branch. Then in series 2 he started appearing as a Transporter Chief (a non officer rank). O'Brien never mentioned on screen being an officer, and I'm sure in some DS9 episodes he made a point out of not being an officer. So while the two appearences in the first season could have technically been one character, O'Brien is a different character alltogether - although he was named "Transporter Chief" for the first half dozen or so appearences in the second season, but it's now taken as that actually being the O'Brien character. The wiki articles for the two season one episodes used to have him listed as O'Brien in them, but this was an error which I've since fixed as the official sources don't list him as being O'Brien until half way into the second season but also state that it was the earlier transporter chief being named. John de Lancie must have done an interview with StarTrek.com at some point, so I'll have a look there. I'm getting quite good at using archive.org to get all the removed information out of that site (having managed to pull production reports for several Enterprise episodes out of the archives). Actually, I've got a new source since I expanded Farpoint, so it might have information on de Lancie's audition process in there. I'll have a look tonight. Miyagawa (talk) 16:59, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keiko O'Brien née Ishikawa, perhaps? I think it's slightly important as she's portrayed as from a Japanese culture and it speaks to the international look of the casting. I'd never heard the fannish handwaving over O'Brien's rank before, but you might be right; he definitely makes a point of not being an officer more than once in DS9. In any case, going by what he's credited as is probably safest. Another thing (sorry to keep coming back!), why do the main cast not get rank, while the minors do? And is it inconsistent to list Federation rank and exclude titles such as Dr/Prof (eg Keiko, Leah Brahms & probably many others)? Espresso Addict (talk) 17:20, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added the ranks as I know of them, and modified the Keiko listing to include her maiden name. Not sure if she actually was a Doctor in her field. I know she was a botanist, but I'm not sure if she was ever referred to as Dr. Ishikawa or Dr. O'Brien. Also ran through all the names to add those that had direct links and found a bunch I'd missed, which are now added. Miyagawa (talk) 19:14, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oh, and the starring/recurring/guest should now sort in the correct order. Thank goodness for find and replace functions! Miyagawa (talk) 19:15, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keiko's referred to as a professor in a DS9 episode, though I fear I can't remember which. Memory Alpha has her as a professor (under categories) but doesn't seem to cite which episode this is referenced to. Espresso Addict (talk) 20:00, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • An episode is good enough for me. Updated to Professor on the list. Miyagawa (talk) 20:07, 12 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ok, I've now expanded the article to include casting information for the main cast where there were some interesting points, and highlighted the major recurring cast members. Miyagawa (talk) 22:54, 13 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from The Rambling Man (talk) 10:27, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comments
  • "the original Star Trek series, which was" no need for the comma.
  • " an Executive producer until" no need for the capital E.
  • "was primarily filmed" -> " was filmed primarily".
  • "the main cast were" I thought "cast" was singular?
  • "as Burton was known" -> "as he was"
  • "The only other two members of the cast mentioned..." are you sure? How can you be sure that just these three members of the cast were the only to be mentioned in the entire press?
  • Just double checked the source and realised I'd misread it - the press release didn't mention the other actors. I'll go fix that in the article now. Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "the show's creator, Gene Roddenberry" you've already told us he was the creator and you've already told us he's called Gene, so just Roddenberry will suffice.
  • Same for Rick Berman, don't repeat his first name.
  • Fixed for both Roddenberry and Berman. That's what I get for adding extra paragraphs into the middle! I forgot where I've already listed things in fully and the duplicate link checker isn't psychic unfortunately. :) Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "of a "street-accent"." is this a quote? If so it should be attributed.
  • It was intended to be, I've added the direct citation now.
  • "Roddenberry thought that" just think "believed" would be better than "thought".
  • True, we're not psychic either! :) Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "but she left after only one " you've lost track of who "she" is as a result of the previous sentence structure.
  • Miles O'Brien appears to be a dab link.
  • Were the seasons really referred to as S1, S2 etc? Or just 1, 2...?
  • They were only referred to as 1, 2, 3 etc - I just thought that S1 etc was the correct format based on the Greys Anatomy model, then then again they didn't have the Series/Film headings in the table. I'll change to 1, 2, 3 etc. Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • You have "Film" as a table heading but have consistently referred to these as "movies" above.
  • Changed to "Movie" for consistency. Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Many abbreviations like "Ens.", "(j. g.)"... which aren't linked or explained anywhere.
  • Just extended the key to cover those. Miyagawa (talk) 10:04, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 15 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

  • Where is the "starring" referenced?
  • That is a good question! While the source places those actors in each film, I didn't think it was appropriate to break them down into guest/recurring etc. I guess I could replace them with something like "Appeared" instead of starring as they weren't one of the headlining cast (although saying that, I think you could say Whoopi Goldberg was, certainly for Generations). Miyagawa (talk) 09:43, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Well unless they're quoted as "starring" (in the credits maybe?) then I guess "appeared" is more appropriate... The Rambling Man (talk) 10:10, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Changed it to appeared and defined it in the notes as "not in one of the recurring main cast roles throughout all four films". Miyagawa (talk) 10:26, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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