User talk:74.64.211.192

February 2024[edit]

Hello, I'm Binksternet. I noticed that you added or changed content in an article, Tony Ashton, but you didn't provide a reliable source. It's been removed and archived in the page history for now, but if you'd like to include a citation and re-add it, please do so. You can have a look at referencing for beginners. If you think I made a mistake, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thank you. Binksternet (talk) 04:52, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Leaving aside the John Lennon album for now, for the George Harrison album I cited in my comment that my souece for the information was Wikipedia's own page on the album (see third musician listed): Wonderwall Music#Personnel

How can tht not be good enough? 74.64.211.192 (talk) 07:05, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia cannot be cited as a reference per WP:USERG. You must go outside of Wikipedia to get your references. Binksternet (talk) 07:07, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for responding.

Is this because your message constituted a challenge? And once there has been a challenge a citation is required (the challenge for example cannot be withdrawn) where it otherwise might not have been?

Let's say I had made no other changes whatsoever except to add this single discography entry, with the comment that I was just making the information consistent across Wikipedia and pointing out the other page. Would that have been sufficient, in the sense that under those circumstances (again, not making any other changes but that one) a challenge would have been unlikely?

Thanks again. 74.64.211.192 (talk) 08:54, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You added two recording projects with no reference.[1] One project is Wonderwall Music which should cite the book by Bruce Spizer: The Beatles Solo on Apple Records. Spizer says the Remo Four participated, including Ashton. The other project is Some Time in New York City which has no supporting citation. Your edit summary suggested online confirmation, but each URL is problematic. You listed these three URLs:

https://www.discogs.com/release/779395-Medicine-Head-One-One-Is-One – Discogs fails WP:USERG and is disallowed by WP:ALBUMAVOID.
http://www.ectours.de – a blog that fails WP:SPS.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Some_Time_in_New_York_City#Live_Jam – Wikipedia cannot be cited per WP:USERG, and in any case you were the one who had added an unreferenced entry for Ashton. So you were citing yourself.

The double LP Some Time in New York City never listed Ashton in the credits. Not the first releases nor the 2010 remaster. He's just not there. Binksternet (talk) 15:28, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you again. This response raises four questions:

1. How is "Jim Price" (uncredited) allowed to stand on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Some_Time_in_New_York_City#Live_Jam? There is no citation. Was there a comment that justified it, and if so could I please see it or at least learn of what nature it was so I know how to justify things similarly going forward?

2. How are ANY of the personnel credits to Wonderwall Music allowed to stand? There is no citation at all?: Wonderwall Music#Personnel Again, was there a comment of some sort that overrode the lack of citation. And, if so, could I please see it or at least learn about it so I can better substantiate things in the future?

3. Can I delete an addition to an article that I erroneously made before I knew of these standards without having it restored erroneously? I will explain the situation in the comments.

4. In addition to the two additions I made that were reversed in Some Time in New York City#Personnel, I also did something inoccuous. To conform to the standards in the remainder of the personnel, wherever there was a new instrument listed but non hyperlinked, I hyperlinked it to the Wikipedia page of the instrument itself. That had already been in place for the studo album credits. I just made the credits for the live material conform to the eact same convention. There is no possible citation for such a revision. So all else aside, were those revisions reversed in error and, can I redo them without reversal (I would explain in the comment).

Thank you. 74.64.211.192 (talk) 02:13, 18 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You can certainly perform innocuous corrections and improvements any time you want. Regarding Jim Price being uncredited, the name should be removed until a valid citation can be found to support it. In general, the personnel listed in an album article are assumed to be the ones named in the liner notes or album credits, which is why you don't see citations in every case. But when there is confusion or contradiction or even mistakes in the personnel section, external sourcing can rescue it, for instance a book describing the recording date. Binksternet (talk) 02:21, 18 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the above, and for all the above. 74.64.211.192 (talk) 06:00, 18 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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