Talk:War bond/Archives/2013

File:So hilft dein Geld.jpg to appear as POTD soon

Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:So hilft dein Geld.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on August 18, 2013. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2013-08-18. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page. Thanks! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:52, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Picture of the day

A 1917 poster by Lucian Bernhard intended to sell war bonds in Germany. The caption, roughly translated, is "This is how your money helps you fight! Turned into submarines, it keeps enemy shells away! That's why you should subscribe to war bonds!" Mostly excluded from international financial markets during World War I, Germany was largely limited to domestic borrowing. The bond drives proved extremely successful, raising approximately 100 billion marks in funds.Poster: Lucian Bernhard; restoration: Bellhalla

Changes to lead

Have restored the changes I made to the lead section. Please say if you have any reasoned objection to any particular aspect of this. ---Ehrenkater (talk) 17:49, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

• The changes it lede run contrary to the format that was previously resolved through consensus. In particular some of the technical elements associated with securities were edited and removed and the purpose of war bonds made more ambiguous. Further your edits include parenthesis text, instead of prose. This is why the text was undone, returned the text to it previous standard. I am returning the previous text until a lead sumary can be agreed to.--Labattblueboy (talk) 18:47, 18 August 2013 (UTC)
• the specific changes I take issue with: 1. the inclusion of parenthesis text, it should all be in prose. 2.the inclusion of "other expenditure" with regards to war bonds.--Labattblueboy (talk) 18:52, 18 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi Labattblueboy

1 You refer to previous consensus; however there has been no discusion of this on the talk page for some years, so what previous consensus?

2 My version of the lead paragraph is completely in prose, so why are you suggesting it is not prose?

3 You object to including "other expenditure". I added this because in time of war the government has other major costs besides purely military operations (to give one example, the costs of food convoys to Great Britain during WW2) and the proceeds of the war bonds are not necessarily earmarked for purely military expenditure.

Reasons for the other changes I made:

4 I removed "War bonds generate capital for the government" as this duplicates what has been said in the previous sentence.

5 I removed "Make citizens feel involved ...". No doubt the government propaganda at the time will focus on this, but the overwhelmingly most important purpose of the bonds is financial, and it is speculation to suggest that, given all the other circumstances of being at war (rationing, air raids, etc etc) the existence of the war bonds makes any significant difference to people's feeling of involvement in the war.

6 I added a sentence about retail and wholesale bonds as this is a key element of the description of these bonds.

7 I added a necessary qualification to "yield below the market". Incidentally "yield below market value" is technically a nonsense because whoever wrote it is confusing the yield and the value of a bond, which are two different things. -----Ehrenkater (talk) 13:36, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

• • I folded the parenthesis text into the text itself. I removed the assumption regarding viable markets. I hope this is a respectable middle ground.--Labattblueboy (talk) 04:07, 20 August 2013 (UTC)