Talk:Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir

A fact from Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 4 February 2019 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that cases against 9,700 Kashmiri youth in India were withdrawn by the government as part of its "healing touch" policy for peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2019/February. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir.

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DYK Suggestions[edit]

@Kautilya3:@DBigXray: There is time for the DYK for this article, time till 6 Jan 2019 I think. Any DYK suggestions would be welcome. DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 14:05, 31 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

DYK1:...that a "healing touch" policy was implemented by the government for Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir, where cases were withdrawn against 9700 youth.[1] DBig Xrayᗙ
DYK1.2...that as part of the "healing touch" policy of the government, cases against 9700 youth were withdrawn for Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir. DBig Xrayᗙ
DYK1.3... that as part of the 'healing touch' policy of the government aimed at peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir, cases against more than 9700 youth involved in stone pelting in the region were withdrawn in 2018.1 2 DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 00:18, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
DYK1.4...that as part of the "healing touch" policy of the Government for Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir, cases were withdrawn against 9700 youths involved in stone pelting. --DBig Xrayᗙ 00:44, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
DYK1.5... that cases against 9700 Kashmri youth were withdrawn by the govt. as part of a "healing touch" policy for peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir.
DYK2...that Srinagar–Muzaffarabad Bus known as Karavan-e-Aman (Caravan of Peace) was started in 2005 for Peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir. Source: The Karavan-e-Aman (Caravan of Peace), a bus service linking Srinagar and Muzaffarabad, was launched on 7 April 2005. [2] Page 2 Paragraph 2 DBig Xrayᗙ

DYK	Score /10 by DBX	DiplomatTesterMan	Kautilya3	overall score
DYK 1	6	3	6	5
DYK 1.2	8	8	5	7
DYK 1.3	6	4	5	5
DYK 1.4	7	7	7	7
DYK 1.5	8	9	8	8.3
DYK 2	7	8	8	7.6

DiplomatTesterMan @Kautilya3: Sorry, I was busy in other pressing matters on Wikipedia, so did not get a chance to reply here. Since there is almost no time, I am nominating the above 3 DYK right away and think about copy editing/ALT Dyks later. --DBig Xrayᗙ 23:58, 4 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

DiplomatTesterMan I think there will be sourcing issues with 1.3 the source outlook doesnt state that all of the 9700 were stone pelters, they can be others as well. --DBig Xrayᗙ 00:27, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I could not find the source for the DYK 2. please help. any opinions on the suggested options above ? --DBig Xrayᗙ 00:29, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@DBigXray: I added the TOI source just now for the DYK 1.3 which clearly says they were related for stone pelting. Good enough? DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 00:33, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

This is the TOI article added - J&K govt okays withdrawal of stone-pelting cases against 9730 people, dated 3 Feb 2018. DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 00:45, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The source DYK 2 is already in the article - by the - International Crisis Group - 2010 Update Brief - Steps Towards Peace: Putting Kashmiris First. Page 2 Paragraph 2. DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 00:41, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Cool. lets see what KT3 thinks about it. --DBig Xrayᗙ 00:44, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

DiplomatTesterMan Kautilya3 lets put these DYKs in order of priority of most favoured and least favoured, since all of them are good. --DBig Xrayᗙ 14:52, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comments:

I rank DYK 2 the most highly, because it addresses the predominant narrative of the Kashmir dispute as an India-Pakistan conflict.
DYK 1.3 is too long-winded and loses interest.
DYK 1.2: "healing touch" and "peacebuilding" are too far apart to allow cognitive linking.
DYK 1 is fine, short and catchy.
Note: "youth" is both singular and plural; "youths" is not a word. "Peacebuilding" should be lower-cased when it occurs in the middle of a sentence. Non-English terms should be italicised. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 15:31, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Agree also I believe Govt should be written as govt. ALT2 may not be interesting enough. ALT1x versions contain the catchy number 9700 cases so I feel they are more likely to be approved as interesting. --DBig Xrayᗙ 15:43, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, agreed. How about this variant:

... that cases against 9700 Kashmri youth were withdrawn by the govt. as part of a "healing touch" policy for peacebuilding in Jammu and Kashmir.

-- Kautilya3 (talk) 16:14, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

yes, this 1.5 is the rearranged version of 1.2, but I like this last version more than 1.2, I think 1.5 will be my first priority. Currently I feel 1.5,2, and 1.4 should be nominated and in that order. --DBig Xrayᗙ 16:31, 5 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I added my score and updated the totals. I like how Kautilya3 added the word "Kashmiri" to "youth". Just one clarification needed, is "govt." purposely used as its short form in 1.5? DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 06:05, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

No DiplomatTesterMan, it was for brevity. The DYK in my opinion should content the word in full i.e. government. I don't agree with Kautilya3's addition of the word Kashmiri. this is redundant because the statement includes the word "peacebuilding in J&K" so it is akin to saying, Indian youths were spared in India". The sentence "Youth were spared in India" gives the exact same message without the repetition of the word Indian. same for Kashmiri. We should either keep the reference to Kashmiri in "Kashmiri youth" or J&K in "Peacebuilding in J&K" the latter cannot be dropped due to wikilinking, hence the former should be dropped.

All three of us based on our relative scores have indicated 1.5 > 2 > 1.2 So i will put the dyks in that order. --DBig Xrayᗙ 11:32, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Kashmiri is an ethnicity. It is the Kashmiris that are agitating against India, not the rest of J&K. It is also Kashmir (the land of Kashmiris) that is in the news everyday. Hence "Kashmiri". -- Kautilya3 (talk) 11:39, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Aren't People of J&K (which was originally Kashmir) called Kashmiri? --DBig Xrayᗙ 11:49, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Are Jammuites and Ladhakis and Baltis also Kashmiris? DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 12:03, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Kautilya3:, @DBigXray: I think the easiest way to resolve this is by seeing what the source says. The sources, both Outlook and TOI, don't use the word "Kashmiri" along with youth. Also, just say someone from outside the state for some vague reasons was also part of this, then using the term "Kashmiri" youth would be incorrect. DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 12:09, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

That would be sub classification. I asked a question that is still unanswered, how do you mention "people of Jammu and Kashmir" ?--DBig Xrayᗙ 12:11, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

No, Jammuites and Ladakhis are not called Kashmiris, and they don't like being called Kashmiris either. There is no general term for the people of Jammu and Kashmir. Christopher Snedden, the first scholar I have seen that disentangle all the confusions and verbal jugglery, calls them "J&Kites". -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:18, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Kautilya3 thanks for elaborating. Got your point, I am still not willing to add Kashmiri there since it is implicit and my intentions to keep the DYK brief, but if both of you still insist that adding Kashmiri is crucial to the proper understanding of this DYK then I will add. --DBig Xrayᗙ 12:25, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I think it is important. In terms of knowledge propagation, which is what we are trying to do here on Wikipedia, it is important to highlight the fact that it is only Kashmiris that are agitating against India. (Also in my view, the day of trifurcating the state into its three separate regions is not far off. When that gets done, more than half of the Kashmir dispute will be resolved.) -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:32, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

ok as you both insisted, I have added Kashmiri to youth in both DYK 1.5 and 1.2. Please review the section on top and let us know if any more copy edits. I did change "a policy" to "its policy" --DBig Xrayᗙ 12:45, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: List of Initiatives to be converted into paragraph form[edit]

This is just to inform all users that the current bulleted list format will be converted to paragraph form, as suggested at AFC help. Accordingly the heading can change to "initiatives". DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 14:41, 31 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, DTM. I have watchlisted the page and will try to help if any issues are posed. Happy New Year to you, and keep up the good work! -- Kautilya3 (talk) 02:01, 4 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! Belated Happy New Year to you too! DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 06:11, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]