Talk:Native Island

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A fact from Native Island appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 30 October 2023 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that New Zealand's Native Island hosted a colony of Samoyeds and huskies used in both the Southern Cross and Nimrod expeditions to the South Pole?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2023/October. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Native Island.

Wikipedia

Did you know nomination[edit]

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by PrimalMustelid talk 18:32, 20 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment or view
Article history

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~~... that nine dogs from Native Island who were originally used in the Southern Cross Expedition in 1899–1900 were also used in the expedition of Ernest Shackleton of 1907–1909?~~ Source: https://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/news/features/300466183/southland-supplied-shackleton-expedition-dogs
- Reviewed:

Created by Panamitsu (talk). Self-nominated at 04:48, 29 August 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Native Island; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.[reply]

New and long enough, within policy, no copyvios found by Earwig. No QPQ needed - this is the user's third DYK. Correctly formatted and concise, possibly could be slightly more concise, link is correct and interesting. I might prefer an alternative:

~~... that nine dogs from New Zealand's Native Island were used in both the Southern Cross Expedition in 1899-1900 and the Ernest Shackleton expedition of 1907–09?~~ but I don't see any major problems here. SportingFlyer T·C 14:24, 30 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

- Yup, that looks good, although it dashes and hyphens have been mixed up.Panamitsu (talk) 05:06, 3 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Panamitsu and SportingFlyer: The hook doesn't match what it says in the article (which says they were nine descendants, not the original dogs). Also not sure where "nine descendants" came from, as I can't find it in the source cited at the end of that sentence. Cielquiparle (talk) 20:43, 3 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

- - How about ALT1: ... that nine Samoyed dogs from New Zealand's Native Island were used in Ernest Shackleton's 1907–09 expedition to the south pole? SportingFlyer T·C 23:48, 3 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  - @Cielquiparle: The source for the 'descendents' part is here, although you need to find Native Island on the map to find it.
    Anglo-Norwegian polar explorer Carsten Egeberg Borchgrevink (1864 –1934), released his Siberian sled dogs on Native Island on the return voyage of his 1899-1900 expedition. In preparation for his 1907-1909 expedition, Ernest Shackleton purchased from a breeder in Stewart Island nine sled dogs descended from those released by Borchgrevink seven years earlier.

@SportingFlyer: Thanks for the ALT hook. I have altered the inadvertant redlink to "samoyeds" in ALT1 above. I have also added the text from the block quote to the footnote in the article. I still don't feel good about this nomination, as the paragraph about the dogs isn't entirely consistent with the quote about Borchgrevink. For example, there's no reference in the article to Borchgrevink or his return trip. Surely the dogs that did make it on the expedition cleared quarantine? Perhaps you could find a better source that explains the whole story instead of overrelying on newspaper articles. Cielquiparle (talk) 03:35, 6 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Cielquiparle: Apologies, I misread your comment. I agree with you that my nomination is wrong and it is the descendents rather than the original dogs. How about ALT2: "...that nine descendents of the Samoyed dogs used in the 1899–1900 expedition to the south pole (who were dropped off to Native Island) were used in the expedition of Ernest Shackleton of 1907–1909?" I think it is much more accurate, but I'm not sure if my wording makes clear enough that it was the original dogs dropped off to Native Island rather than the descendents. Panamitsu (talk) 05:14, 6 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Panamitsu: problem with ALT2 is that the sentence is a bit of a mess trying to get everything conveyed... how about ALT3: ...that New Zealand's Native Island hosted a colony of samoyeds and huskies used in both the Southern Cross and Nimrod expeditions to the South Pole?

That needs a bit of editing as well I think but it's a bit cleaner. SportingFlyer T·C 08:02, 6 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@SportingFlyer: Agreed. I support ALT3. Panamitsu (talk) 23:28, 6 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

This needs a new reviewer for ALT3. Z1720 (talk) 15:06, 24 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

ALT3 is cited, interesting, and approved. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 17:51, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Re: Battle[edit]

In the early 19th century, there were Māori battles fought on Native Island

I looked into this, and except for the cited source, I could find nothing. This is probably because the naming conventions have changed over the years and the battle is likely described in other terms. Also, if this battle was part of the New Zealand Wars, it should be linked. Finally, since this is the earliest history mentioned in the article, why not place it first in the section? Viriditas (talk) 21:09, 10 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]