Talk:Mardi Gras/Archive 1

This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

Archive 2

Change the name to Mardi Gras Season

The article clearly discusses the Mardi Gras Season, not just Mardi Gras Day. There may need to be two entries, one discussing the celebrations during the season and then one for mardi gras day, the day before ash wednesday.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.58.111.10 (talk) 22:08, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Article for New Orleans

As we get more material in the article, perhaps the information for the New Orleans celebration might be spun off into a seperate article, perhaps entitled something like "Mardi Gras, New Orleans"? -- Infrogmation 20:24, 27 Jan 2004 (UTC)

I've been working on a "New Orleans Mardi Gras" article the current draft of which is at present in my user space at User:Infrogmation/New Orleans Mardi Gras. However others are very welcome to add/edit/comment before the move to main article space. Carnivalistically, -- Infrogmation 20:49, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)

I just moved it into article space at New Orleans Mardi Gras. -- Infrogmation 13:51, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Translation of "Mardi Gras"

Just a note for anyone who might consider adding alternative translations of "Fat Tuesday": for those not familiar with the US "Mardi Gras", the usual translation in the States is "Fat Tuesday" and that is also an alternative name for the festival. I've ventured the opinion that the "gras" could actually be better translated literally as "greasy" or "fatty", but this seems to be a matter of disagreement. My idea is that "gras", which can mean "fatty" (as in "cheveux gras" seen on bottles of shampoo for greasy hair), refers to the butter and lard people ate on that day, before giving it up, thus "fatty Tuesday". However, other people believe that "gras", which can mean "overweight", refers to the weight people put on eating that food, thus "overweight Tuesday". To me this seems only a matter of opinion, but as the name "Fat Tuesday" is so common, I'm being told my opinion, although a few others share it, is irrelevant and unhelpful and should not be added to the page. As I don't know if I'm right and it's just an alternative idea, I'm removing it, but I thought I'd write a note here in case anyone else had the same idea. Saintswithin 10:16, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Actually "Greasy Tuesday" is the proper translation. Just my two cents.--Qwertyu63 (talk) 23:34, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Citing Sources

I've skimmed the Wikipedia guidelines for citing references sources, but am uncertain as to how to go about citing references or sources for the information I've added under New Orleans, since everthing I've written is a result of being born here and attending Mardi Gras for many years. Any ideas how to cite sources? Comments

Those guide lines are good ideas when editing artices by filling out details gained from particular sources. As the most recent edits to this article seem in the line of general observations that can be confirmed by anyone attending the parades and are not likely to be controvercial, I wouldn't worry about it in this case. Thanks! Cheers, -- Infrogmation 22:47, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)

New Orleans pronunciation of 'Carnival'

I took the liberty of removing the reference to a New Orleans pronunciation of the word "Carnival," to wit, "car-nee-VAHL ... in New Orleans, Louisiana, because of its French heritage." In 33 years living in New Orleans, I never once heard that. If anything, we could include a yat pronunciation, "CAW-nuh-vul." -- Muffuletta 00:13, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

French Only??

Is it really accurate to imply that only french settlers celebrated mardi gras? surely the tradition existed among other Catholic settlers of different ethnicities (albeit under different names).

Disagree. As far as I know, it was really the French who settled in New Orleans who brought Mardi Gras with them. I will eventually cite as my reference a video made by Arthur Hardy (considered by many the ultimate authority on New Orleans Mardi Gras) which traces the French arriving in New Orleans and their first attempts at re-creating Mardi Gras in the New World. rich 21:37, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Edited and popped off SLO Mardi Gras page

The previous entry about the Mardi Gras controversy in San Luis Obispo was NPOV (noting that the riot was "caused" by police brutality, but not the city's concerns over drunkenness, vandalism, injuries, etc.). The more I tried to summarize it the more obvious that an unique article, covering the entire timeline, would be more appropriate and objective. Noirdame 00:38, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

2006 Edit/Revert War

Over the last few days, I have been involved in a continous edit war with an Anon user. The gist of the debate is if Mobile, Alabama has the oldest celebrating Mardi Gras in the US and the second largest, or if Lafayette, Louisiana does. Personally, I've always heard that Mobile was the one, and seen this cited by numerous sources. The Anon user, who hasn't given any cites (despite several calls early on to do so) claims that Lafeyette does. If anybody else could attempt to check things indepenently, it would be helpfull. Thank you. Donovan Ravenhull 11:15, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

Per the Wikipedia entry for Lafayette, Louisiana, this city was founded in 1821. Mobile, Alabama, on the other hand, was founded in 1702, and is said to have celebrated its first Mardi Gras in February 1703. Rlm0710 20:03, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

US Mardi Gras Cities

There have been a series of anon editors making conflicting claims as to repective sizes of celebrations in Mobile, Lafayette, Houma, and Galveston. I suspect some of this may be civic boosterism. Please give exact figures and sources to support claims made as to respective sizes. I suggest that any such claims offered without supporting evidence simply be reverted or edited to change from superlative adjectives to simple NPOV statement that celebrations take place there. -- Infrogmation 18:53, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Just reduce to the NPOV version; pretty much any attendence figures would be published by the respective municipality and would be suspect. AUTiger ʃ ^talk/_work 06:07, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

To be honest, I wish I could find some independent verification on relative sizes, though this year is a bit of an oddity in that area due to post-Katrina issues. Also, it is widely held in this area that Mobile is the birthplace of Carnival in North America, but I must admit that as a Mobilian, I have some prejeduces. Donovan Ravenhull 11:10, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

I posted about the Mardi Gras in San Diego in Hillcrest that has been deleted... any idea why? There are two celebrations in San Diego. One in the Gaslamp and one in Hillcrest -both have corporate sponsors and both are very large - the Hillcrest one is in the gay district. This is the 6th year its been held. It is the third largest event of the year in Hillcrest (Pride followed by City Fest then Mardi Gras). Did I do something wrong?

Largest

This "largest celebration" thing is strange - the part about Mobile says it had the largest with 240,000 people, but the St. Louis part says they regularly have 600,000 people. I think most of these comments should be changed to "one of the largest". --Awiseman 20:47, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

I'll leave it to others but Carnaval in Trinidad is reputedly the second largest in the hemisphere after Rio and predates Mardi Gras in N.O. which it not only shares an incredible amount of similarities but a common history/cross pollination of ideas.

George Street Mardi Gras

Last night I added in about the Mardi Gras celebration that occurs in St. John's in October (it was last night, in fact), but it was removed. I vote that the St. John's version be included, because it IS named Mardi Gras after the traditional festival, and has the same idea in spirit (costumes), but is held around Hallowe'en. --Zeromaru ^T ^C 19:11, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Mardi Gras is not about costumes but rather, a celebration before Lent. The Canadian info would be better at Halloween, as it is in October and concerned with costumes. Cheers. L0b0t 20:11, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

More images maybe?

Could we perhaps have some more pics of carnival around the world, one for each posted example maybe? Would that put too much strain on older computers and slower connections? L0b0t 21:54, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Removed Sydney Mardi Gras

I removed the Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras from the list of Mardi Gras celebrations. This move is not motivated by homophobia but by the need for consistency. The article is about Mardi Gras celebrations held on Fat Tuesday as part of or rooted in Catholic lent observances. The Sydney "Mardi Gras" only uses the name but is an entirely different type of event unrelated culturally to the other festivals and which also takes place at a completely different time of year and not on Fat Tuesday. I placed an internal link to the Sydney festival in the see-also section at the bottom of the article.--Dreko 12:07, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Bam in NO

Did Bam visit during Mardi Gras? If so, that should be added in, if not, this line should be removed. "Bam Margera and his friends visit New Orleans in a Season 2 episode of Viva La Bam." DeMyztikX 22:52, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't belong in a general overview article of Mardi Gras in any case. -- Infrogmation 05:48, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Mobile

Its great that some people have been interested in adding more about Mobile Mardi Gras. Might I suggest starting an article on that subject ("Mardi Gras in Mobile" or a similar title) that could go into more detail? However, please be careful to state verifiable facts, rather than slogans or boosterism. Calling Mobile "the Mother of Mardi Gras" seems to fly in the face of the fact that Mardi Gras was celebrated for hundreds of years in Europe before it was first brought to the New World. The current claim that " longest tradition of observing Mardi Gras in the Western Hemisphere" seems dubious as well, given the traditions in such places as Cuba, Mexico, Panama, Haiti, etc that were settled earlier than Mobile-- if you wish to make such a claim, have supporting references and comparative dates of the starts celebrations elsewhere. -- Infrogmation 05:48, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

What's Wrong?

Yeah... I noticed that under the dates subtitle, there is something talking about "Coach Leo" and uses bad language. I tried to edit it out, but it does not appear in the editing box. What's up?

Edit: Never mind, I think it's gone.

Still there.

Try reloading the page. -- Infrogmation 14:36, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Semi-protected

Due to the slew of anon vandalism, I've semi-protected the article for a week. -- Infrogmation 14:36, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. That was quite a wave of nonsense. L0b0t 14:48, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Change Salvador,Bahia to Salvador da Bahia under Locations

{{Editprotected}} Salvador,Bahia doesn't link to the right place, and having the comma in there is just plain confusing.

Done I've fixed the link so now it points to and links to Salvador, Bahia. However, I've left the comma, because there are a number of places (including a number which are arguably more famous) that share the same or a very similar name - see Salvador. Thanks for reporting the redlink mistake.Changed it to Salvador da Bahia, with the link pointing to Salvador, Bahia (ie. Salvador da Bahia). Cheers, Daniel.Bryant 10:02, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Merge with Shrove Tuesday?

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of the discussion was keep.

Look at the opening sentence of these two articles:

Shrove Tuesday is the term used in the English-speaking countries of the United Kingdom[1], Ireland[2], and Australia[3] to refer to the day after Collop Monday and before Ash Wednesday (the liturgical season of Lent begins on Ash Wednesday).

Mardi Gras (French for "Fat Tuesday") is the day before Ash Wednesday, and is also called "Shrove Tuesday" or "Pancake Day".

There's something very wrong about having two articles about exactly the same day, with similar traditions. I acknowledge that the traditions associated with the term "mardi gras" are somewhat different to those of "Shrove Tuesday", but perhaps the articles could be divided better? Why, for example, does this sentence appear at mardi gras — "In Slovenia is called Kurentovanje. Its from word Kurent and its a name of the mask, made of sheep skin, richly decorated and they make noise with bells attached on hips. Its also traditional to eat doughnuts." — and not in the "Other cultures that eat a particular food on the day before Ash Wednesday" section of Shrove Tuesday? Anyone have any suggestions? Stevage 11:21, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

No merging, absolutely not; by no manner of means; leave well alone. The two days mark the same point in the Christian liturgical calendar, so it's not surprising that there should be two (and more) similar feastdays in different cultures. But Shrove Tuesday (Pancake Day) is a very different beast from Mardi Gras. Merging these two would be the greatest folly, a poking of the finger of curiosity into the pie of impertinence. Perhaps a great distinction between the two is called for, but merging? I say thee nay!!! (Not sure why I'm talking like the Burton translation of the Arabian Nights today. Must be tired. Forgive.) Garrick92 12:05, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

If you're talking about two different *traditions*, then sure, two separate articles. But then where would you put stuff that is neither, like the Slovenian example. Is the distinction between mardi gras and shrove tuesday really an international thing? Or is it just that mardi gras exists in France and the US (bizarre to say that...) while Shrove Tuesday is elsewhere? If so, then shouldn't those be two sections on the one page? Do Shrove Tuesday and Mardi Gras both exist in the US? Stevage 13:16, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Another vote no. Merging "Pancake Day" with "Shrove Tuesday" is already debatable. To merge with "Mardi Gras" as well is ridiculous. Nick 12:24, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

I oppose a merge. They are distinctly different celebrations and merging these articles would bloat the resulting article unneccesarily unless information is lost in the process. - 131.211.210.20 13:13, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

That anon comment was mine. - Mgm|^(talk) 13:16, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Also, Mardi Gras isn't the same as Pancake Day because as far as I can tell Mardi Gras doesn't have any pancake related traditions. - Mgm|^(talk) 13:19, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
I totally oppose the merge. Shrove tuesday and mardi gras are totally different animals. They not even the same sort of animal. They dont even come from the same planets. Itd be like merging Keith Chegwin and George Bush. Bobo the clown and Santa. A large tiger and a small puppy. Its just wrong. 82.32.184.26 15:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

If they are so different, why are the introductions so similar? Something in the intros has to make it absolutely clear why they are different. And no one has yet explained it. Should mardi gras start something like "Mardi gras is a celebration that takes place on Shrove Tuesday"? There's also something very weird about mardi gras not even referring to the French origins of the name. What does the 'fat' refer to? Surely it's the same origin as the pancakes, which were made to use up leftover butter/fat? Stevage 00:10, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

I also oppose a merge. Each article should have a link to the other for reference, but (in this part of UK at least) there's no connection between the two. --Smalljim 18:21, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Merging may not be the right solution, but some serious reorganization is definitely needed. I propose: 1) An umbrella article at a to-be-determined location discussing the Christian holiday that comes before Ash Wednesday in a culture-neutral way, just looking at the history and such without going into the details of what happens in New Orleans or any other specific place. 2) More specific articles, linked from the umbrella article, about different festivals in different places/cultures, e.g. Mardi Gras in NO, Shrove Tuesday in England and some other places, Fastnacht/Fasching in Germany/Switzerland, and so on. Comments? Chl 18:16, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, that sounds pretty good. Any idea what to call it? I thought "Shrove Tuesday" was as neutral as "Ash Wednesday" but obviously not? Stevage 13:18, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Oppose. No entry for Mardi Gras in Wikipedia? Am I missing something here? Please clarify. --Kkmurray 00:18, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Oppose. While the arguments that this could be handled better are very valid, and the culture-neutral comment above makes some sense. These are both essentially specific feast days that come from a similar (christian) background but have their roots in two different creeds, catholic and protestant. I think the cultural and physical differences between these two merit separate articles, although a 'pre-lent festival' type page would make a nice umbrella for them, and any other 'pre-lent festivals' that are around. EasyTarget (talk) 17:10, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Oppose Same day, but different Holiday. Also each article is large enough with little to no common information between them. Merging them would result in one huge confusing article. Nar Matteru (talk) 17:29, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

←=== Same tradition with different names === I really think we should reopen this discussion. "Shrove Tuesday" and "Mardi Gras" are certainly just two different names for exactly the same day: Namely the last day before Lent in Western Christianity. It is a natural idea and a tradition in most cultures to eat something delicious on the last day before the fasting. The "fat" in Mardi Gras refers to the fatty food one eats on this day. The tradition of eating pancakes (described in article "Shrove Tuesday") is very similar. Look at the initial definitions of the two articles. It is clear that both names are synonyms for "the day just before Lent".

The fact that some people in southern USA don't know the word "Shrove Tuesday", or that some people in Britain don't know "Mardi Gras" does not make these two different concepts. It's the same. In other languages, this specific Tuesdays has names meaning "Fat Tuesday", "Meat Tuesday", "White (i.e. white food) Tuesday", "Carnival Tuesday". How should the Wikipedia articles in those languages make their interwiki links to the English Wikipedia when there are two articles on the same day?

I think there should be one main article about "Tuesday just before Lent". Traditions in specific parts of the world could well have their own articles as well, with link from that main article. /JeppeSN (talk) 16:44, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Nope. Just because they take place on the same day in the Christian calendar does not automatically make them the same event by any means. I grew up near Houston and celebrated Shrove Tuesday at my church. The Mardi Gras celebrations in the same area are extremely distinct events from that, with basically no connection beyond time of year. Mardi Gras has taken on a life of its own. I'm basically agnostic now, living in the great unchurched Northwest, but I can clearly see the distinction between the two. They are both very different articles, and so should they be. --Siradia (talk) 07:15, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Oppose. Gosh, there are so many 'opposes' here we could take off the 'discuss the merge' box on the pages in question. I don't have much to add but I'll throw in my two cents nonetheless. The idea of "Shrove" Tuesday calls to mind confession and repentance, quite a far cry from "Fat" Tuesday, especially with modern Mardi Gras observances, which are often outright displays of hedonism. These definitely need to be separate articles. But I am in complete agreement with creating a Tuesday Before Lent article that discusses the topic generally, links to both Mardi Gras and Shrove Tuesday, and removes the need for repeated and miscellaneous information in these more specific works. PeterMottola (talk) 02:58, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Oppose. I already think merging "Pancake Tuesday" with "Shrove Tuesday" was a mistake. Mardi Gras and these holidays are so far apart culturally and spiritually that the article would just be a desperate attempt to find commonality. For example, Episcopalians who celebrate Pancake Tuesday have no history of Carnival whatsoever, which is the backbone of most Mardi Gras celebrations. Quenn (talk) 12:09, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Oppose merging. links and references back and forth highlighting similarities is ok, but definitely two distinct holdiays that share the same date. Sf46 (talk) 00:31, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

"For" Merging They are the same thing —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chas9fan2003 (talk • contribs) 17:02, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Oppose Although on the same day they are not the same thing. Mardi Gras has a much larger coonotation than Shrove Tuesaday and is in fact 'Carnival' Shrove Tuesday is rather different and localised. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.155.216.218 (talk) 18:44, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Support Fat Tuesday redirect here... all celebrations on this date should, in my opinion. Then, have different sections for different cultural traditions. нмŵוτн τ 20:37, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Oppose Merging would make the subject at hand even murkier than it already is. Support weeding out the various Carnival celebrations that are not based in a Catholic tradition from the former colony of French Louisiana. It is "Mardi Gras" and not "Pancake Day" or "Carnaval" after all. Altairisfar _talk 16:14, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Merging Pancake Tuesday and Mardi Gras

Should not be merged. Two different celebrations on the same day. Like the 'Melbourne Cup' and Yarra Glen Races on 'Cup Day'. Same day, different events.

The Mardi Gras article needs cutting. All those international sections talk about Carnival instead of the final day (Mardi Gras). The article should focus on the topic at hand. - 131.211.210.20 13:16, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Agree. Mardi Gras is a day. Carnival is a season. rich 21:40, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

disagre. Mardi Gras is a season. Not a just day. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.203.38.195 (talk) 23:42, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Slovenia Section.

It needs to be worked through. I don't feel established with the subject enough to edit it to full understandability, but if someone else has time/the ability to do so, it is necessary. Valencerian 04:04, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Point du Mardi Gras French Translation

The original French name was "Pointe du Mardi Gras" (which is pointed out in the articles Notes for reference no.1) with an 'e' not "Point du Mardi Gras" and I suggest that the translation is "Point of Fat Tuesday" or "Fat Tuedday Point" not simply "Mardi Gras Point" as this only translates one word and not the entire name.

I'd just like some opinions before editing anything. David PJ Webster 19:45, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

I speak French. I agree on the 'pointe' vs 'point' (for non-French speakers, 'pointe' means 'tip', or 'point' like a headland - something that juts out, whereas 'point' means dot, spot, speck...). However, 'mardi gras point' seems like a better translation to me than your proposals. In the article, we've already established how 'mardi gras' is translated literally. And since it was named after the celebration, and not literally a random Tuesday that happened to be fat...I don't see what would be gained. Stevage 00:14, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

heck no

h*** no were not going to combine mg with st —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 4.229.237.238 (talk) 22:42, 16 April 2007 (UTC).

Expanding sections and organization

Perhaps I've been too bold, but I took the liberty of organizing this article by rearranging locations alphabetically by country and locations within the US alphabetically by state. There did not seem to be any rhyme nor reason to the previous arrangment, with Louisiana first, the "Other U.S. cities" next, and then the rest of the world. I expanded the Venice, Recife, Rio de Janeiro, Salvador, New Orleans, and Mobile sections more, but only the Mobile section is reasonably referenced. This article is in dire need of reference material all over. Of course, most of what is contained here would probably truly belong in the Carnival article more than this one, but that is most likely unavoidable since, at least in the U.S., people seem to think that Mardi Gras and Carnival are synonymous. I plan to do more work on references soon. Oh, almost forgot, what does everyone think about the relevance of Sydney, Australia; Goa, India; San Luis Obispo and San Diego, California; Detroit, Michigan; and Port Arthur, Texas to this article??? Altairisfar (talk) 10:30, 18 November 2007 (UTC) also mardi gras in the lowest populalated holiday in the uk —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.65.158.119 (talk) 15:36, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Fire?

"New Orleans Mardi Gras...locals for the parties and parades. The starting date of festivities in New Orleans is unknown (or perhaps records burned in 1788 or the Civil War), but considering Mobile celebrated in the French manner from 1703, and the capital of French Louisiana was moved to New Orleans in 1723, the Mardi Gras tradition probably moved also: an account from 1743 notes that the custom of Carnival balls was already established by that date" The city did not burn during the Civil War! Who wrote this someone from Mobile? Read this:[1] Poor article.--Margrave1206 (talk) 15:58, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

I've corrected what you've correctly pointed out and added the reference that you've given. Thanks for seeing that. DEZnCHRIS (talk) 19:26, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

"Exactly 41 days before Easter"

Carnival begins 12 days after Christmas, or Twelfth Night, on January 6 and ends on Mardi Gras, which always falls exactly 41 days before Easter.

This is incorrect. When the Church talks about the 40 days of Lent before Easter, they do not count the Sundays. If you actually count the days, you'd find out that there are actually always more than 40 days in Lent. Therefore, it follows that Mardi Gras never falls exactly 41 days before Easter. I'm removing that part of the sentence. Stever Augustus 20:00, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Someone deleted the page

Someone has deleted the entire page and replaced it with the words "Boobs for 12 days, hell yeah!" While this may be in the spirit of Mardis Gras, it's hardly appropriate for wiki. Just letting you know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by FreemDeem (talk • contribs) 11:48, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Carnival/ Shrove Tuesday/ Mardi Gras

I removed a redundant mention of Shrove Tuesday and Carnival in the intro that made the sentence read more clearly. They are mentioned again at the end of the paragraph so no encyclopedic information was lost. But I still think that this page seems to blur the line between what is called Mardi Gras and all of the other celebrations that have developed celebrating that time of year calling themselves other things. And a look at those pages shows hardly a mention of Mardi Gras at all.

Although, as I've read the history of this page, I realize that "Fat Tuesday" redirects here and so all of these other traditions shouldn't be removed entirely unless someone wants to accumulate all of this information onto a Fat Tuesday page of it's own and allow this one to be simply for celebrations called "Mardi Gras" DEZnCHRIS (talk) 18:53, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Split

I think that the "United States" section should be split off, since it's unbelievably large, much larger than it needs to be compared to the other sections in the article. In fact, some of the sections within this section have their own articles, so I think it makes sense to condense the information here to allow the article's scope to remain broad. Any agreement or objection?

Hires an editor (talk) 16:05, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

I concur. The "United States" section is huge. my name inc 20:55, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

"FAQ on Mardi Gras" link goes to a porn site!

The first link under External Links titled "FAQ on Mardi Gras" points to "http://0c0f5b36.qvvo.com/" which redirects to a porn site. Needs to be removed ASAP! Elness (talk) 18:32, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

'this page refers to the carnival'

Why only the carnival? Mardi Gras also includes what many British people know as Shrove Tuesday or Pancake Day. They're part of the same thing so why doesn't the article cover both events? I'm British but like any sophisticated Brit I've always known the day as Mardi Gras.--Xania ^talk 21:19, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Merge with Carnival

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of the discussion was keep.

Look at the two pages, both are made up of sections linking to Carnival traditions in various countries. Mardi Gras is just the last day of Carnival and the Carnival page already has a much bigger list of celebrations. This would better reflect the current content of the page than the earlier suggestion to merge with Shrove Tuesday. Nick (talk) 00:04, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Object to merge I strongly oppose a merger of the two articles. While Carnival and Mardi Gras are tangentially related, they are sufficiently distinct enough to warrant discrete articles. Cheers. L0b0t (talk) 14:24, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

"The terms "Mardi Gras" (mär`dē grä) and "Mardi Gras season", in English, refer to events of the Carnival celebrations"

Mardi Gras is just the last day of Carnival. How is that tangential? Nick (talk) 00:09, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Please check out the rest of this talk page where the merger idea has been rejected before. L0b0t (talk) 14:21, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree that this page shouldn't be merged with Shrove Tuesday. That's why I made a different suggestion. Nick (talk) 18:41, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Oppose Maybe in some parts of the world, but around here, we celebrate Mardi Gras & have never heard of Carnival. hmwith τ 14:37, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

If you've really never heard of Carnival, then I see two options: 1. Change the name of this page to Mardi Gras in the USA, OR 2. Read the first sentence of the article - "The terms "Mardi Gras" and "Mardi Gras season", in English, refer to events of the Carnival celebrations"

Actually, I'm starting to think that the first option would work. The info for all the other countries is already on the Carnival page. Nick (talk) 18:37, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Mardi Gras is held February the 24th. It is always 46 days before Easter. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.218.68.101 (talk) 20:18, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Object to merge I object as well. Mardi Gras "Fat Tuesday" is a day WITHIN a season (Carnival) and has it's own identity. Similar to Ash Wednesday. Ash Wednesday is a day within Lent but if you look up Ash Wednesday here, you will find it has it's own page. And so should Mardi Gras "Fat Tuesday". I believe links to Carnival would suffice. Rundaddyd (talk) 11:26, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

I totally object as well. Carnivals have rides and trashy music. Mardi Gras is a big thing round here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.131.255.46 (talk) 18:05, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Strong support. Mardi Gras is simply the last day of Carnival season. (Should there also be a special day for Lundi Gras?!) It seems that it would be more useful to separate the celebration of Carnival into various places, e.g. Carnival in the U.S., Carnival in XXX, rather than basically repeating much of Carnival on the Mardi Gras entry. That said, as a Louisianian, I find it terribly odd to refer to the entire season as "Mardi Gras season". Crazy Anglophone Americans. :P L ^talk 14:17, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Quebec "Winter Carnival" inclusion with Mardi Gras

Winter Carnivals are pretty common in Canada around that time but most are unrelated to Mardi Gras - we just need a way to liven up winter! This article makes no mention of actual celebration in relation to this actual belief system or cultural event, only the time-period. In fact, the article referenced (11) states that it has a "Mardi Gras feel," describing the festive spirit and jazz. If you read the rest and look at the events, there is no other mention of Mardi Gras. In addition, although this link is active and the material chances, the announcement of the arrival of Bonhomme and the carnival events for 2010 (10) makes no mention of Mardi Gras celebrations, and that is recent! (Trust me, Bonhomme has nothing to do with Mardi Gras: Bonhomme is just a walking snowman used throughout Canada - at least Quebec and Ontario - and name is a shortening of the French word for snowman "bonhomme de neige.") I suspect this was just added as a source of promotion for the carnival. Mardi Gras is not that popular in Canada, despite our large French population.--Blondtraillite (talk) 04:22, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

ORIENT

In the ORIENT a symilar day is observed as PETHRATHO exactly fifty days prior to easter. It is on February Fourteenth in 2010 for the new calendar followers as in INDIA.The lent starts at Pethratho evening coinciding the start of Biblical clock at nightfall. Every three hours or yamams the christians have to prey except at 3.00 in the morning totalling seven times a day. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.93.23.83 (talk) 05:53, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Archive Proposal

Going to suggest that this page be archived via MiszaBot I. Given how old some of the discussions are, I think this is a pretty clear move. I'm going to recommend archiving threads more than 3 months old, leaving a minimum of 5 discussions on the page. I'll leave this open for at least 3 days and wait for feedback (i.e. objections).--Gnowor^Talk2Me_{did wha?} 07:14, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Given no opposition, I've implemented archiving.--Gnowor^T_C 20:08, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Why no reference to the Sydney Mardi Gras?

It's the Mardi Gras in Sydney tonight, which is a huge celebration and march by Sydney's gay and lesbian community which has been here every year for the last 20 years. It's pretty much an international event, with airline tickets apparently very hard to obtain around this time. I'm surprised that there is no reference to this event on this page; unless there's a good reason why not, I guess I'll add one. cojoco (talk) 01:38, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Because this is an article about Mardi Gras, which was last Tuesday. Naming an event "Mardi Gras" does not actually make it "Mardi Gras". I can call my office party next week "Christmas" but that doesn't make it eligible for inclusion in the Christmas article, notability aside. Maybe someone should research and write an article about the Sydney event and include a link or add it to the see also list. Otherwise it doesn't meet the criteria in my opinion for incusion on this page. Heironymous Rowe (talk) 03:38, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

There is an article on it, Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras. Some explanation as to why it is called "Mardi Gras" when it doesn't take place on Mardi Gras might be a very helpful addition ot the article. -- Infrogmation (talk) 03:48, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

I think these comments are a bit disingenuous. Your example is non-notable and really a bit silly. Christmas doesn't have much to do with Christ these days, either, yet we still call it so, and I notice that the article on Christmas includes all its uses. Mardi Gras round here means only one thing, and it's nothing to do with catholicism. Maybe I'll beef up the disambiguation links a bit. cojoco (talk) 23:25, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

As I said "notability aside" for my funny example. All of the other events on this page are Mardi Gras or Carnival. Add it to the "See also" list, add it to lists of LGBT festivals and parades, I'm not saying it doesnt belong on the pedia. But I still do not think it meets the criteria for inclusion in an article about Mardi Gras. Heironymous Rowe (talk) 23:43, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Mardi Gras (blow-out day) in Iceland

Blow-out day (Sprengidagur) is the Tuesday before fast, 7 weeks before Easter. It's name is considered to come from eating a lot before the fast, blow your stomach out. On this day people eat salted meat and beans. Originally Icelanders ate salted meat on blow-out day because salt was rare to find and it was considered a feast to get salted meat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Br1982 (talk • contribs) 18:20, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Mardi Gras (blow-out day) in Iceland

Blow-out day (Sprengidagur) is the Tuesday before fast, 7 weeks before Easter. It's name is considered to come from eating a lot before the fast, blow your stomach out. On this day people eat salted meat and beans. Originally Icelanders ate salted meat on blow-out day because salt was rare to find and it was considered a feast to get salted meat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Br1982 (talk • contribs) 18:21, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Australia?

Syndey, Australia also has a fairly large Mardi Gras. Should it be included in this list?--Senor Freebie (talk) 10:17, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

See the discussion above from a month or so ago. Heironymous Rowe (talk) 18:01, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Removing overlap with Carnival

Per the now-archived merger discussion, where the consensus seemed to be that Mardi Gras and Carnival should remain separate articles because they are not the same topic, my inclination is to remove from Mardi Gras the sections that appear to be talking about "Carnival" and not specifically "Mardi Gras." The Carnival article is a total mess, but repeating the same information here doesn't help. Propaniac (talk) 16:56, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Is this page being hijacked?

I notice when I read the page that the words "la la la" have been inserted in the first paragraph, and that a lot of the small town Mardi Gras events have an overly promotional tone (LaFayette, the coolest place on Earth? Yeah, right!). Yet when I open the "edit" window, these things aren't there - and refreshing the article window will show that they are still in the article. Is someone hijacking this article? Or is there something going on about Wikipedia that I don't know about?

zouk is a french or french country music that has the meaning of party —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.48.195.57 (talk) 01:00, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

New post

March 2nd is not a Tuesday. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.39.230.63 (talk) 16:16, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Corrected per this Shrove Tuesday#Dates. He iro 17:11, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Sydney Mardi Gras

Nothing as of yet mentions the Sydney Mardi Gras held the weekend before Ash Wednesday. It is significant because it is unique in the fact that it is the only Mardi Gras celebration that is in fact a gay rights parade through the city. This should be amended and placed into the main article due mostly because of how different it is and also seeing as there are categories for many major countries, yet none for Australia. Bit disappointed in you wikipedia — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cactus flower1er (talk • contribs) 09:43, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

Its not mentioned at this article because this article is about fat tuesday, which the Sydney event has nothing to do with. For the Gay Rights parade that happens to use the words Mardi Gras in its name, see Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras. He iro 18:56, 5 March 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 173.80.127.88, 9 March 2011

{{edit semi-protected}}

173.80.127.88 (talk) 00:34, 9 March 2011 (UTC) Hey people don't use this page it has been edited by thousands of other people like me!!!!!

Not done: Not a edit request. —Gƒoley Four— 02:05, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

um...Canadian Mardi Gras?!? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO......

The person who wrote this could not be serious. Mardi Gras is NOT celebrated in Canada at even a tenth of the extent that the Louisianans celebrate Fat Tuesday. I don't think there is anything even happening outside in any city in Canada to celebrate this (obviously not in Montreal because it just snowed 80cm). I know Canadians feel inferior to the USA, especially when it comes to French things, but this claim is just silly. In fact, this is so outrageously false, I'm just going to delete this from the article. Phobal 02:33, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Oh, and the article used to support the fallicious claim that: "Quebec City and Montreal hold Mardi Gras celebrations, with events such as music festivals, comedy festivals, food festivals, and street parties" actually makes no reference to Mardi Gras (because said festivals do not exist), only that Summer in Montreal "feels like Mardi Gras-on-the-St. Lawrence, with jazz fests and Caribbean fêtes..." Phobal 02:37, 9 March 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Phobal (talk • contribs)

Australia

Why is Australias mardi gras not in here when the first reference is about the the Australian mardi gras? Jasonbentvelzen (talk) 06:47, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

Because people fail to read this talkpage or its archives where this has been discussed before and insist on occasionally inserting it into the article. This article is about the holiday that happens after Epiphany and culminates on the day before Ash Wednesday, which the Sydney event does not. I've removed the reference but added a link to the see also list. He iro 11:30, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

Bahia is not a city its a state.

the sentence "The city of Bahia also holds a large carnaval celebration" should be the city of Salvador also holds a large carnaval celebration — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rbnunes (talk • contribs) 19:33, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

Nice St Louis

Nice that St Louis isn't mentioned once here. Way to write a factual Mardi Gras. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.217.139.122 (talk) 02:41, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Moved your comment down here, since you posted it in the middle of someone else's comment. Someone had too much drinky drinky? See here Mardi Gras in the United States. He iro 02:58, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the compliment, anon! Perhaps you could join in improving content: log in, take some photos of Mardi Gras in St. Louis, and upload them under a free license? Happy Carnival, -- Infrogmation (talk) 18:25, 22 February 2012 (UTC)