Talk:John Hegley

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Trivialities?[edit]

_ _ I think the sorth of trivialities being objected to are quotes of things he says. They reflect the sort of humour that is integral to his work. Poetlister 08:31, 2 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

  • In case i was unclear, P-l's observation points the way, not to leaving the article as it is, but to
    • verifiable information that these factors are important to his ostensible notability, and
    • putting that information into the article instead of just throwing it out for readers to guess about.

_ _ By analogy, bear in mind that it is not just technical constraints that make us write about opera rather than having our articles sing about it. Encyclopedias make clear and direct statements about poets and their work, and must not imitate poets and poetry in communicating via allusions the reader must work out, and preferring pregnant ambiguity over baldly saying what we mean in so many words.
_ _ The difference between triviality and significance in this case is probably the difference between reciting trivia and citing a few trivia as concrete examples of his exploitation of trivia to achieve his ostensible humor.
--Jerzy•t 21:53, 2 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
On 3 October 2005, P-l noted (perhaps with Hegleyan humor? [smile])

Clean-up tag inserted 1 October 2005 - Hegley's 52nd Birthday!

--Jerzy•t 17:27, 4 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
The following material, as previous mentioned, is unsuitable without context that would make it encyclopedic:

He wears glasses and despises contact lenses, both of which are made clear in his first book, Glad to wear Glasses: other passions include potatoes, dogs and his home town of Luton. He plays the ukulele and uses his cashpoint card as a plectrum.
His dog ran away in 1985.

I am unable to correct that, due to my ignorance of him. If it's true, something like this (but certainly not to the exclusion of improved wording of the trivia itself) might IMO make all the difference:

It is typical of his humor that his fans are aware of these facts:
  • He wears glasses and despises contact lenses, both of which are made clear in his first book, Glad to wear Glasses
  • Other passions include potatoes, dogs and his home town of Luton.
  • He plays the ukulele and uses his cashpoint card as a plectrum.
  • His dog ran away in 1985.

Actually, that intro is the kind of lame one you'd expect from someone who is ignorant; inquiring minds want to know whether his humor runs to self-mockery, and whether he believes that the trivia of one's life is more authentic and valuable than supposed profundities, and things i can't even imagine.
--Jerzy•t 22:06, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Are you sure that "His dog ran away in 1985"? I have heard on the radio that although Hegley writes a lot of poems about dogs, he has never actually owned one. Vorbee (talk) 16:31, 27 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Why the revert?[edit]

I see that Jerzy deleted all my amendments. These were an attempt to make this article more encyclopaedic and to provide substantial information about John Hegley. Could Jerzy please explain which of these amendments is factually wrong or does not make the article more encyclopaedic? I hope that he did not do it just because he wants to keep the article as a poor imitation of Hegley-type humour rather than a valid Wikipedia article. Poetlister 14:18, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

_ _ IIRC, and as the cmt & summary i made immediately after suports, i must have
  1. consulted the Page history bcz of noticing the totally unsuitable reference in the article to the cleanup tag, which it should be obvious is part of the page without being part of the article (and within which, BTW, is indeed no place for musing or commenting on it)
  2. put my attention on the two edits that referred to it,
  3. concluded both of those edits needed reverting, and
  4. used the revert lk on the page for the diffs-between-versions page linked by the latest "last"-lk in the Page history, as would have been appropriate if i had been correct in my impression that you made two, not three, consecutive edits.
_ _ The effect was as you describe, but my intent was entirely different from what you saw.
_ _ While i of course regret that effect, leaving it at that would sound to me (putting myself on either, or any, side of this matter) like a weasel-worded "non-apology". It is a fact that i am too compulsively careful about what i do here, and i simply don't blame myself, don't regret the level of caution i exercised on that occasion. To me, this unfortunate incident should be treated as "part of the cost of doing business" here.
--Jerzy•t 21:39, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Review"[edit]

_ _ I'd know better what to suggest doing with this:

===Glad To Wear Glasses Review===
John Hegley is Luton's most famous poet. His whimsical style is well-known, and there's a lot of short, endearing stuff in this collection - the silly 'Blackburn And Preston', the grim humour of 'Grandad's Glasses', the dark 'Looking After Your Dog', the poignant poems, 'Dreaming My Dad' and 'The Death Of A Dog'.
John may well be considered eccentric by some, but if he was a poetry teacher, poetry would be the new football!

if i knew what it is intended to be. It's rare that we include a quote of this size, and it may be long enuf to involve a copyright problem if it's a quote, and if it's not a quote, we certainly would not care about his status in his home town (let alone one that sounds like the small pond of a London suburb) or use metaphors like "the new football!"
_ _ We need a hint here, can you buy us a vowel?
--Jerzy•t 22:38, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Anyone whose attitude to Luton is that it "sounds like the small pond of a London suburb" is probably ill qualified to say anything about John Hegley.
Poetlister 22:47, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Are we done?[edit]

Treating Jerzy's apology to me as it deserves to be treated, is the article now acceptable? Can we remove the clean-up tag?
Poetlister 22:45, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Cleanup" is a little of a misnomer, as removing stuff is usually not enuf to get to a good article. Give the other 100K or so editors a chance to mull it over; something wonderful may happen yet.
--Jerzy•t 05:15, 6 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Nonsense. There's a big difference between cleaning up an article and expanding/improving it. The questions are:
Why was the tag put there in the first place?
Are these reasons still valid?
Clearly, if they are not still valid, the tag must be removed. Replace it with an expand tag if you will. And to think that more than a handful of Wiki editors will ever bother to edit this article is as sensible as to assume that the tooth fairy will do it.
Poetlister 17:34, 6 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]


Alice Looking Through the Glasses[edit]

Does any one remember "Alice Looking Through the Glasses", a Radio Four programme that was broadcast in 1994, about a girl who needed glasses for astigmatism? This could be mentioned in the article, as could Hegley's other work. ACEOREVIVED (talk) 20:39, 8 June 2011 (UTC) I do not know whether it was on Radio Four - it might have been on BBC Radio Two - but it might be worth a mention in the article if anyone can find a reliable source for it. Vorbee (talk) 17:52, 23 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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The Popticians[edit]

This article could mention that he has a pop group called "The Popticians". They did a song called "Spare Pair". Vorbee (talk) 18:29, 19 December 2018 (UTC) I see that they are now mentioned in the "Discography" section. Vorbee (talk) 18:50, 30 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

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