Talk:Iron Thunderhorse

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles

Connecticut Low‑importance

	Connecticut portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Connecticut, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Connecticut on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ConnecticutWikipedia:WikiProject ConnecticutTemplate:WikiProject ConnecticutConnecticut articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

It is requested that a photograph be included in this article to improve its quality.
The external tool WordPress Openverse may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites.

Upload

74.189.86.12 (talk) 02:33, 11 January 2011 (UTC)Crimes? Why is there no mention of the crimes he has been convicted of? Is he not currently serving time in prison? I would think that this would be significant biographical information.[reply]

Exactly what are the circumstances behind the crimes? I can find nothing solid on his previous life. Unless more solid details on his past can be provided, I move that we remove that section. Besides, the supposed "reference" links on his jail term (or any of the references on his past in general) are either nonexistent or completely irrelevant. I say we remove them.

The circumstances have nothing to do with the FACT that he is an inmate in a texas prison, and has been since 1978. It seemed odd to me that "awcolley" seemed determined to remove or hide any reference to the fact that Thunderhorse is a convict, so I looked and it appears that "awcolley" is affiliated in some way with Thunderhorse, apparently having run a website for him. As stated below this page is basically a promotional site for Thunderhorse, with any negative information quickly removed. BTW, the link to the TDCJ website is not dead. It is an active link providing FACTS on Thunderhorse's current status as an inmate. Last time I check an encyclopedia was a reference source containing FACTS. The fact is, he is an inmate and has been for over 30 years. This information is not irrelevant and has nothing to do with "supporting" his incarceration. Its just a fact that I feel carries just as much weight as him being the CEO of whatever and having written books. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.189.89.218 (talk) 05:42, 5 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Unless we can get some real facts on this guy (and not hearsay, blind support, or libel), then all we are left with is basically a promotional pamphlet for the guy, including a bibliography as well. That's not really material fit for Wikipedia, so we might as well remove the page. VelociraptorBlade (talk) 04:10 PM, 02 June 2011 (PST)

I removed irrelevant and dead links cited in the opening section "supporting" the issue of his incarceration within the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. I also removed that portion of the opening section and created a "Controversy" section. NOTE: The authorized biography of Iron Thunderhorse, written by Ruth Thunderhorse and mentioned in the article, is available at http://www.buybooksontheweb.com/Product.aspx?ISBN=0-7414-3977-8 or by mail as explained at http://acqtc.org/Store/HomePage. Awcolley (talk) 16:17, 18 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

References[edit]

There are no links to any of the supposed references, so there is no way that another editor can validate a single one of any of the claims in this article. In addition, almost every one of the references either comes from this person, from someone with the same last name, or from someone with the name he used before he called himself this. Very few independent sources, if any. Corvus cornix 04:49, 22 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

None of the articles or books are available online, how is one supposed to link to them? Most of the newspaper articles cited are from the 80s and early 90s. Few newspapers (if any) provide online copies of anything that old.Awcolley 05:14, 22 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Can you provide ISBN numbers? Corvus cornix 05:23, 22 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I have added some ISBNs. I doubt the items published by QTC Press have an ISBN, but I will check.

I have added all the ISBNs we could find. Books published by QTC Press or Thunderbird Free Press do not have ISBNs. I have edited this article significantly to reduce the amount of unverifiable claims and "bold assertions". Most, if not all, remaining assertions have been clarified as expressed opinions, viewpoints, memories, etc. I am now looking for online references for dissenting opinions/viewpoints to bring this article closer to NPOV nirvana. Awcolley 04:18, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

After several hours of Googling, I have been unable to find any substantive dissenting opinions online. Awcolley 03:53, 3 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

For dissenting opinions about William "Iron Thunderhorse" Coppola, contact Christopher Wike, Texas Assistant Attorney General/Law Enforcement Defense Division; P.O. Box 12548, Austin, TX 78711; christopher.wike@oag.state.tx.us. Much of the information about Iron Thunderhorse has been written by his supporters and advocates, who parrot information he passes along to them. The reason much of the information cannot be substantiated is that is largely a fictionalized account of his life. [Donn LeVie,Jr. co-author of "Return of the Thunderbeings" with Iron Thunderhorse]

Christopher Wike left the Texas Attorney General's office in August 2009, and naturally they cannot provide current contact information for him. I have done numerous online searches for negative information on Iron Thunderhorse / William Coppola and found nothing but a couple of unsubstantiated and nonspecific statements listing him among several others accused of pretending to be Native American. If anyone has proof of such allegations, you should feel obligated to present them; otherwise, we can only assume Iron Thunderhorse is who he says he is. Awcolley (talk) 05:10, 12 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Legitimacy[edit]

I [Donn LeVie, Jr.] am the co-author of "Return of the Thunderbeings" with William Coppola (aka "Iron Thunderhorse"). Shortly after the publication of the book I disassociated myself with Mr. Coppola. Most of his life is his own fictional creation I later learned, particularly his Native American ancestry claims (the Texas Attorney General's office has contacted me on several occasions about his claims that I continue to be one of his ardent supporters, which I am NOT). Mr. Coppola used me for his own motives which was to further his own causes. He is indeed a talented writer and gifted, creative artist, but many if not most of his claims of his lineage, experiences, and knowledge are fictional.

63.215.26.168 15:04, 25 August 2007 (UTC)Donn LeVie, Jr.[reply]

Can you offer any proof that you are Donn LeVie (or Le Vie), Jr, and more specifically the one who co-authored Return of the Thunderbeings? What evidence can you offer to substantiate your accusations that William Coppola/Iron Thunderhorse is misrepresenting his lineage, experiences, and knowledge? If you have evidence, it needs to be heard; if not, then why are you impugning Iron Thunderhorse? Awcolley 03:36, 26 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry for the delay in my response as I wasn't aware this page would be updated so soon. I don't know what "proof" you need that I am who I say I am. Read my comments I entered on the Amazon.com page for the book, Return of the Thunderbeings. I go in to more detail there. As for evidence, why don't you contact the Texas State Attorney's office about the facts of who William Coppola really is. I have been interviewed many times over the past few years by phone and in person my a team of attorneys who presented me with the evidence about his background. He has a reputation for filing frivolous lawsuits and, like the luck of a blind squirrel who occasionally finds an acorn, one of his lawsuits was deemed to have some merit and a court date was set. I don't have copies of the state's evidence but you can contact Christopher Wike, Assistant Attorney General, Law Enforcement Defense Division at P.O. Box 12548, Austin, TX 78711-2548;[email and phone number deleted] . Let me close by stating that I have already devoted too much time and space responding to this issue that I consider closed. Iron Thunderhorse betrayed my trust as he's done to countless others. To all interested parties: Please get the whole story from others before you become an advocate for him just based on his word. I do, however, hope that one day he comes clean about who he really is and can redirect his creative energies into a more positive direction in a selfless manner. -->

While the issue may be closed for you, to merely state accusations and then require the reader to substantiate them is hardly reasonable. If you (or anyone else) has actual evidence or experience to corroborate your accusations that Iron Thunderhorse is a fraud, then please share it here. I have searched the internet on numerous occasions to find any evidence of fraud; I am unable to find anything other than one article which merely includes Iron Thunderhorse on a list of "Native American pretenders" without any further discussion (i.e. particularly any reason or evidence for including him on the list). Awcolley (talk) 05:53, 7 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Contact the Texas Attorney General's office for more information. I do not have access to that information. 66.68.70.56 (talk) 00:55, 23 February 2009 (UTC)Donn LeVie, Jr.[reply]

I have recently contacted the Texas Attorney General's office and they have no such information. They only maintain records and files related to various lawsuits against the Texas Department of Corrections and Justice of which Iron Thunderhorse has been a party (mostly related to Native American's rights to practice their religion in prison as freely as Christians, Jews, and Muslims do). Awcolley (talk) 05:18, 12 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]