Talk:Dmitry Gudkov

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography: Politics and Government

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by the politics and government work group (assessed as Low-importance).

Politics Low‑importance

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Russia: Politics and law Low‑importance

	Russia portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Russia, a WikiProject dedicated to coverage of Russia on Wikipedia. To participate: Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the project page, or contribute to the project discussion.RussiaWikipedia:WikiProject RussiaTemplate:WikiProject RussiaRussia articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by the politics and law of Russia task force.

"non-systemic opposition"[edit]

NYT writes:

"In Russia, parties are defined as “systemic opposition” and “non-systemic opposition,” according to current political parlance, with the former being opposition in name, but in fact backing Mr. Putin on most matters."

This is nonsense. Non-systemic opposition means opposition outside "system" ie., outside formal political establishment. American journalist has no say how the Russian-introduced concept is defined. That Gudkov was expelled from his party does not automatically make him "non-system". He is still in parliament, ie., within "system". - üser:Altenmann >t 06:21, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

When you state "This is nonsense", do you have a reference (regarding non-system opposition, Gudkov, or otherwise)? If you do, please post it here for attempted clarification on your intent.

Pardon my ignorance, but I don't know User:Altenmann as an RS. I personally don't know, and I am just going by what presumably credible RSs state. From my understanding of what Wikipedia is, it wouldn't be my place to say here even if I did know anyway. 69.58.42.90 (talk) 00:06, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

When I state this is nonsense, I mean that the journalist was ignorant in Russian political terminology. The proper references and proper definition are in the corresponding article. - üser:Altenmann >t 18:44, 24 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

How about this? Since the NYT states "Because of the fragility of his seat, the People's Freedom Party and Open Russia have cleared the field for Mr. Gudkov, who is with the Yabloko party. " and from the only english reference on "non-system opposition" (openDemocracy): Opposition parties inside the system; "There are 3 others, which are not represented in the Duma: ‘Right Cause’, ‘Yabloko’ and ‘Patriots of Russia’." And outside.. "The best known of them are the People's Freedom Party, 'Other Russia' and the Russian United Labour Front."; I'd suggest this addition:

While Gudkov joined the "systemic opposition" Yabloko party and worked with the non-systemic opposition, he lost in the 18 September 2016 election for the Russian Parliament.

69.58.42.90 (talk) 19:06, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

What is the reference for this statement?

Please keep in mind that Russian terminology about their opposition is a mess. There is "non-systemic opposition", "non-parliamentary opposition", "white ribbon opposition", etc. For an English reader the confusion is increased by Russian terminology for legally defined types of assembly ('assembly' here is generic term as in "freedom of assembly"), which does not exactly match English terminology. Even Russian-language writers got confused and some list into non-sys oppo both Left Front (Russia) and People's Freedom Party (eg Russian wikipedia does). Therefore please avoid using labels even if they are used by "pundits". And Gudkov is a perfect case to the point: NYT unwittingly pigeonholed him into non-sys, while he was simply biding his time. - üser:Altenmann >t 03:55, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Even if the People's Freedom Party is in question, Open Russia not a registered party and is opposition.

While Gudkov joined the "systemic opposition" Yabloko party^[1]^[2] and worked with the non-systemic opposition, he lost in the 18 September 2016 election for the Russian Parliament.^[3]

How about the above (then locate references at the end of the sentence)? 69.58.42.90 (talk) 20:17, 29 September 2016 (UTC) Since there has been no response in over a week, I'll add it. 69.58.42.90 (talk) 19:29, 9 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Russian opposition: inside or outside the system?, Grigorii Golosov, September 1, 2011 (retrieved February 8, 2015)
^ Andrew E. Kramer (September 15, 2016). "Russia's Opposition, While Repressed, May Be Its Own Worst Enemy". NYT. Retrieved September 20, 2016.
^ Neil MacFarquhar (September 19, 2016). "Vladimir Putin Tightens Grip on Russia's Parliament With Election Rout". NYT. Retrieved September 20, 2016.

External links modified (January 2018)[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Dmitry Gudkov. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://www.webcitation.org/6Bkyvoime?url=http://www.molpalata.ru/persons/show/?id=8%2F to http://www.molpalata.ru/persons/show/?id=8%2F
Corrected formatting/usage for https://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/23/world/europe/ponomarev-works-to-change-russia-from-the-inside.html?_r=0

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 08:04, 22 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

[golo-1] Russian opposition: inside or outside the system?, Grigorii Golosov, September 1, 2011 (retrieved February 8, 2015)

[2] Andrew E. Kramer (September 15, 2016). "Russia's Opposition, While Repressed, May Be Its Own Worst Enemy". NYT. Retrieved September 20, 2016.

[3] Neil MacFarquhar (September 19, 2016). "Vladimir Putin Tightens Grip on Russia's Parliament With Election Rout". NYT. Retrieved September 20, 2016.

[1]

[2]

[3]