Talk:Dhu Nuwas

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[Untitled][edit]

According to the Encyclopedia Britannica 2006, his name was Yūsuf Asar Yathar and 'Dhū Nuwās' was merely a nickname.

Joey 00:19, 8 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The article seems to imply that he was killed in battle against King Kaleb around 520 CE for offending Kaleb and Emperor Justin in 524... Anyone have more information on these dates? Hiberniantears 12:55, 22 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

reorganization needed[edit]

The main section has been edited in isolated parts, with the result that the material in paragraph 2 (result that his attacks on Christians and defeat by the Axumite king) is all repeated a couple paragraphs later. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.12.245.132 (talk) 04:18, 24 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

King Yusuf Asaar Yathar is Dhu Nuwas[edit]

dhu nuwas other name was mentioned in the yemeni inscriptions as 'yusuf asar yathar

Dhu nuwas & burning the christians of najran is a story created by ibn ishaq persian historian, the story is based on quranic verses (اصحاب الاخدود) believers been burned in the trench and the reason why they killed {وما نقموا منهم إلا أن يؤمنوا باللّه العزيز الحميد} because they believe in god, the himyaris also believe in god (rahman).

Contested deletion[edit]

This page should NOT be speedily deleted because...the implication of stating the name "Yusuf Dhu Nuwas" - as stated in Ibn Hisham's "Sirat Rasul Allah", better known in English as "the Life of Muhammad" - is that he is one and the same person as As’ār Yath’ār. The reason for the dual name has been explained as meaning Yusuf, "lord of the forelock," meaning, [Yūsuf] As’ār Yath’ār was a Jew who grew out his side-locks; "nuwas" meaning, "forelock" or "sidelock." Furthermore, the historicity of this king is without question, since he is mentioned by Philostorgius and by Procopius, the latter of whom writes that in 525, the armies of the Christian Kingdom of Axum in Ethiopia invaded Yemen at the request of the Byzantine Emperor, Justin I, to take control of the Jewish kingdom in Ḥimyar, then under the leadership of As’ar Yath’ar (more commonly known by the appellation Yūsuf Dhū Nuwās), who rose to power in 522. Ibn Hisham explains the same sequel of events under the name of "Yūsuf Dhū Nuwās." Indeed, with this invasion, the Ḥimyarites were smitten, and as such the supremacy of the Jewish religion in the Kingdom of Ḥimyar, as well as in all of Yemen, came to an abrupt end.

Imrū al-Qays, the famous Yemeni poet from the same period, laments the death of two great men of Yemen, one of whom being Dhu Nuwas (As’ar Yath’ar), in his poem entitled, taqūl lī bint al-kinda lammā ‘azafat, whom he regards as the last of the Himyarite kings. These were his words in the poem:

"Art thou not saddened how fate has become an ugly beast, / the betrayer of its generation, he that swalloweth up people? It has removed Dhū-Nuwās from the fortresses / who once ruled in the strongholds and over men / [An armored knight, who hurriedly broke the ends of the earth / and led his hordes of horse unto her uttermost parts And has shut up a dam in the place of the sunrise / for Gog and Magog that are (as tall as) mountains!]"

For Your Information: The entire poem is brought down only in a-Ṭūsī's version of the dīwān (concerning which, see the words of the editors of Imrū al-Qays, Dīwān imrī al-qays wa-mulḥaqātuh bi-šarḥ abī sa‘īd al-sukkarī, ed. Abū Suwaylim & al-Šawābika, Muḥammad, UAE 2000, p. 105–110), while the two stanzas which are shown here in brackets have been taken from al-‘Iqd al-ṯamīn (ibid., p. 714, n. 1). The two stanzas have also been included in an abridged version of the poem, Imrū al-Qays, Dīwān imrī al-qays, Ed. al-Ayyūbī, Yāsīn, Beirut 1998, p. 472–473.--Davidbena (talk) 08:41, 3 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Philostorgius[edit]

It says that his historicity is endorsed by Philostorgius, but the link to Philostorgius suggests that the writer lived a hundred years earlier... I think it probable that it's supposed to link to someone else. 07:14, 24 October 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.246.245.7 (talk)

Philostorgius may have actually lived before Dhu-Nuwas, but Philostorgius mentions in his chronicles the city of Zaphar (Dhofar) which had in it a Christian Church made by the Abyssinians. It was the same church that was later destroyed by Dhu-Nuwas.Davidbena (talk) 22:39, 24 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The article needs a lot of work[edit]

This article is so badly organised and so badly referenced that I have found jokes in it. Ibn Hisham has never claimed that Nawus means "sidelocks". Nawus is the root of the Arabic word نوس SharabSalam (talk) 02:44, 19 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

My friend, thank you for your edits. I do not doubt that you are knowledgeable about the Arabic sources which speak of Dhu-Nuwas, and I do believe that your service is needed in introducing these accounts here, in this article. With that said, in most Western literature, Dhu-Nuwas is, in fact, mentioned as "lord of the forelock." You may wish to Google this epithet to see its use in a wide-range of literature. Secondly, I do not understand why you felt it necessary to delete the following paragraph:

One Syriac source appears to suggest that the mother of Dhū Nuwās may have been herself a Jew hailing from the Mesopotamian city of Nisibis.^[1]^[2] If so, this would place her origins within the Sassanid imperial sphere, and would illuminate possible political reasons for his later actions against the Christians of Arabia, who were natural allies of the Byzantine Empire.^[1] Many modern historians, though Christopher Haas is an exception, have argued that her son's conversion was a matter of tactical opportunism, since Judaism would have provided him with an ideological counterweight to the religion of his adversary, the Kingdom of Aksum, and also allowed him to curry favour with the Sassanid shahanshah.^[3]

I'm looking forward to hearing your feedback.

References

^ ^a ^b Jonathan Porter Berkey, The Formation of Islam: Religion and Society in the Near East, 600-1800, Cambridge University Press, 2003 p.46.
^ 'Irfan Shahid, in the Introduction to his book, Martyrs of Najran (published in 1971), quotes from the Nestorian Chronicle from Saard (Séert) edited by Addai Scher (see: Patrologia Orientalis vol. IV, V and VII), compiled shortly after anno 1036 CE from extracts of old Syriac historical works no longer extant, saying: "…In later times there reigned over this country a Jewish king, whose name was Masrūq. His mother was a Jewess, of the inhabitants of Nisibis, who had been made a captive. Then one of the kings of Yaman had bought her and she had given birth to Masrūq and instructed him in Judaism. He reigned after his father and killed a number of the Christians. Bar Sāhde has told his history in his Chronicle."
^ Cite error: The named reference Haas was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

Davidbena (talk) 03:15, 19 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

that information about Dhu Nawuss forelock is new to me and I believe it's only mentioned in western sources at the beginning I thought it was a joke. SharabSalam (talk) 20:01, 19 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yusuf Asar Yethar is not Dhu Nuwas[edit]

This article contains a significant amount of misinformation. Firstly, the Arabian king “Yusuf Asar Yethar" is not "Dhu Nuwas." Additionally, the story surrounding these two figures is vastly different. According to inscriptions, Yusuf Asar Yethar was a worshipper of the god Rahman and successfully defeated the Abyssinian forces in Arabia. On the other hand, the story of "Dhu Nuwas" as mentioned in books suggests that he killed the residents of Najran because they also worshipped Rahman. It is believed that Dhu Nuwas ultimately drowned himself in the sea due to fear of facing the Abyssinian forces. However, the inscriptions mention that the people of Najran, who belonged to the tribe of Hamden, were under the leadership of Shrhal Du Ezn in Yusuf Asar's army. It is important to distinguish between historical figures and mythological figures 109.253.161.237 (talk) 09:34, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[Berkey-1] Jonathan Porter Berkey, The Formation of Islam: Religion and Society in the Near East, 600-1800, Cambridge University Press, 2003 p.46.

[2] 'Irfan Shahid, in the Introduction to his book, Martyrs of Najran (published in 1971), quotes from the Nestorian Chronicle from Saard (Séert) edited by Addai Scher (see: Patrologia Orientalis vol. IV, V and VII), compiled shortly after anno 1036 CE from extracts of old Syriac historical works no longer extant, saying: "…In later times there reigned over this country a Jewish king, whose name was Masrūq. His mother was a Jewess, of the inhabitants of Nisibis, who had been made a captive. Then one of the kings of Yaman had bought her and she had given birth to Masrūq and instructed him in Judaism. He reigned after his father and killed a number of the Christians. Bar Sāhde has told his history in his Chronicle."

[Haas-3] Cite error: The named reference Haas was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

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