Talk:Columbia University/GA1

GA Review[edit]

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Reviewer: Racepacket (talk) 09:24, 12 April 2011 (UTC) GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria'[reply]

Thank you for nominating this article. I believe that every American University should have a Good Article on Wikipedia. Please unlink Carman Hall. Fn 7 and 37 and others are dead external links. GaryColemanFan's prior review can be found here.

Is it reasonably well written?
A (prose):
hyphenate "Pritzker prize-winning"

Verb tense: "Starting in 2010, admissions to Columbia's undergraduate colleges Columbia College and the School of Engineering and Applied Science will accept the Common Application. The policy change will make Columbia one of the last major academic institutions and the last Ivy League university to switch to the common application."

"they play host to film screenings and concerts." - unfortunately, the immediate antecedent of the pronoun is "students." Need to fix.

In the "Students" section, please add commas in numbers greater than 1,000.

"A satellite site in Paris holds classes at Reid Hall." - Clarify Paris France rather than Paris, New York south of Utica.

Missing space between "Band" and "is".

B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:
Avoid side by side pictures. Rather, staggar them on the left and right margins.

Although not required by GA criteria, the WP:UNIGUIDE would reverse the order of the Campus and Academics sections.

Under WP:UNIGUIDE the faculty could be discussed under Academics or under notable people. I would make Research a separate stand-alone section and move the faculty from that section to the People section. Why are some faculty in the "Faculty and Reseach" section and others are in the "People" section?

"Recent seminar speakers include Mark Cuban, owner of the Dallas Mavericks and Chairman of HDNet, and Blake Ross, creator of Mozilla Firefox." - avoid relative time references.

Given the nav
Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
A. References to sources:
Fn 7, 37, 119, 123. 134 and 136 are dead links. Fn 26 is a naked URL please use {{cite web}}.

Fn 34 is a NYTimes article, but it does not support the claim, "Columbia now has one of the most comprehensive financial aid policies among the nation's colleges and universities." This borders on puffing. The NYTimes suggest that a number of schools are doing what Columbia is doing to expand financial aid.

B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
History section needs a lot more footnotes. If a single source supports the entire paragraph, just put it at the end of each paragraph. If multiple sources are relied upon, please add footnotes to help the reader find the sources.

Each person in the "People" section as well as the faculty that are named should have a footnote to a reference that documents their connection to Columbia.

"Alma Mater is also the subject of many Columbia legends. The main legends include that the first student in the freshmen class to find the hidden owl on the statue will be valedictorian, and that any subsequent Barnard student who finds it will marry a Columbia man, given that Barnard is a women's college. Another legend exists that back-up Alma Maters are kept at the ready should need arise after one alum supposedly heard Alma Mater blow up in the 1970s. During prospective student tours, Columbia tour guides tell students to rub Alma Mater's foot, for this ensures admittance to the University." - I am really waiting to see how you reference these with reliable sources. If no relable sources can be found, please delete.

"The wrestling team is the oldest in the nation, and the football team was the third to join intercollegiate play. A Columbia crew was the first from outside Britain to win at the Henley Royal Regatta. Former students include baseball Hall of Famers Lou Gehrig and Eddie Collins, football Hall of Famer Sid Luckman" - need refs. Only Karyn Marshall is supported by the refs given.

"There has been a Greek presence on campus since the establishment in 1836 of the Delta Chapter of Alpha Delta Phi." - need source

"The Philolexian Society is a literary and debating club founded in 1802, making it the oldest student group at Columbia, as well as the third oldest collegiate literary society in the country. It annually administers the Joyce Kilmer Bad Poetry Contest." - need source

"The Columbia University Marching Band is one of Columbia's most notorious student group, due to both its penchant for edgy humor and its central role in campus traditions such as Orgo Night" - reference supplied supports Organic Chemistry night, but not the other claims.

"There are a number of performing arts groups at Columbia dedicated to producing student theater, including the Columbia Players, King's Crown Shakespeare Troupe (KCST), Columbia Musical Theater Society (CMTS), NOMADS (New and Original Material Authored and Directed by Students), LateNite Theatre, Columbia University Performing Arts League (CUPAL), Black Theatre Ensemble (BTE), sketch comedy group Chowdah, and improvisational troupes Alfred and Fruit Paunch." - need sources

"It is the oldest gay student organization in the world," - when making a broad claim like this, you need a reliable secondary source that would be in a position to know. The primary source given says founding was in 1967, but Columbia Wikipedia article says 1966.

C. No original research:
Legends, sports, history all have interesting material that goes beyond the sources provided.
Is it broad in its coverage?
A. Major aspects:
Explain how the orginal Columbia college Regents continued on to become the Regents of the University of the State of New York and supervisors of the NYS Dept. of Education.

Was the University Press one of the early ones? I think that Cornell's was older.

Organization needs more than list of colleges. Discuss the Board of Trustees - how many and how are they selected? Any student, faculty or alumni elected trustees?

Campus section should discuss sustainabilty.

Why are is the article clear as to whom Alfred Lerner Hall is named after, but you sluff off with Uris Hall. Why not wikilink to the donor? In this case Percy Uris. (Harold Uris, his brother went to Cornell.) Perhaps wikilink all of the buildings named after people with a Wikipedia article.

I remember that when Cornell built its medical school dorm (Lasdon House), it had to prepare an Environmental Impact Statement. Are the building controveries described in the campus expansion section subject to an EIS requirement? Do they require approval by the NYC Board of Estimates? Please explain to the reader how the angry neighbors have leverage over the University's construction plans.

Perhaps expand each of the other campuses from a single sentence into a full paragraph.

B. Focused:
Article is very long. Consider WP:SPLITting off "History of Columbia University" as a separate article.

Is the Ahmadinejad visit worth a separate section and/or 2 paragraphs? Should this be a part of the history?

In 1968 there was a major antiwar demonstration/building occupation at Columbia. But it is not covered in the history which focuses only on the gym construction. There were also antiwar protests after 1968. Student activism deserves more than just 3 sentences.

Barnard relationship needs more explanation - they take Columbia classes.
Is it neutral?
Fair representation without bias:
"ROTC ban" as a section heading is too-POV. How about "ROTC controversy" or "ROTC on campus"?

"Columbia is home to two pioneers in undergraduate student broadcasting" - unsourced puffing that could be stated in a neutral way.
Is it stable?
No edit wars, etc:
No edit wars.
Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
File:Young alexander hamilton.jpg - no reason to believe that this is the "work of the Federal Government." Use expired copyright template.

B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
Overall:
Pass or Fail:
This article represents significant work by its author. I usually put articles on hold so that I can work with the nominator to bring it to Good Article status. However, there are so many unsourced statements that it would take a considerable period of time to do the necessary research, so I will fail the article to allow you to work at your own pace. I encourage you to address the above items and renominate it. I promise to give it an expedited review when it is placed back into the queue. Good luck. Racepacket (talk) 23:18, 12 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA Revision[edit]

Okay, I decided the most efficient way to address this would be to just go point by point. Here's a rehash of the list placed earlier. If a point is bolded, that means I addressed it directly and solved it without any issue. If it's italicized, it means that I didn't correct it for some reason, which I will adress as well.

Is it reasonably well written?
A (prose):
hyphenate "Pritzker prize-winning"

Verb tense: "Starting in 2010, admissions to Columbia's undergraduate colleges Columbia College and the School of Engineering and Applied Science will accept the Common Application. The policy change will make Columbia one of the last major academic institutions and the last Ivy League university to switch to the common application."

"they play host to film screenings and concerts." - unfortunately, the immediate antecedent of the pronoun is "students." Need to fix.

In the "Students" section, please add commas in numbers greater than 1,000.

"A satellite site in Paris holds classes at Reid Hall." - Clarify Paris France rather than Paris, New York south of Utica.

Missing space between "Band" and "is".

B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:
Avoid side by side pictures. Rather, staggar them on the left and right margins.

'Although not required by GA criteria, the WP:UNIGUIDE would reverse the order of the Campus and Academics sections.

Under WP:UNIGUIDE the faculty could be discussed under Academics or under notable people. I would make Research a separate stand-alone section and move the faculty from that section to the People section. Why are some faculty in the "Faculty and Reseach" section and others are in the "People" section?

"Recent seminar speakers include Mark Cuban, owner of the Dallas Mavericks and Chairman of HDNet, and Blake Ross, creator of Mozilla Firefox." - avoid relative time references.
Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
A. References to sources:
Fn 7, 37, 119, 123. 134 and 136 are dead links. Fn 26 is a naked URL please use {{cite web}}. (All of these worked for me...not sure if the numbers changed or what.)

Fn 34 is a NYTimes article, but it does not support the claim, "Columbia now has one of the most comprehensive financial aid policies among the nation's colleges and universities." This borders on puffing. The NYTimes suggest that a number of schools are doing what Columbia is doing to expand financial aid.

B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
History section needs a lot more footnotes. If a single source supports the entire paragraph, just put it at the end of each paragraph. If multiple sources are relied upon, please add footnotes to help the reader find the sources.

Each person in the "People" section as well as the faculty that are named should have a footnote to a reference that documents their connection to Columbia.

Alma Mater is also the subject of many Columbia legends. The main legends include that the first student in the freshmen class to find the hidden owl on the statue will be valedictorian, and that any subsequent Barnard student who finds it will marry a Columbia man, given that Barnard is a women's college. Another legend exists that back-up Alma Maters are kept at the ready should need arise after one alum supposedly heard Alma Mater blow up in the 1970s. During prospective student tours, Columbia tour guides tell students to rub Alma Mater's foot, for this ensures admittance to the University." - I am really waiting to see how you reference these with reliable sources. If no relable sources can be found, please delete.

The wrestling team is the oldest in the nation, and the football team was the third to join intercollegiate play. A Columbia crew was the first from outside Britain to win at the Henley Royal Regatta. Former students include baseball Hall of Famers Lou Gehrig and Eddie Collins, football Hall of Famer Sid Luckman" - need refs. Only Karyn Marshall is supported by the refs given.

There has been a Greek presence on campus since the establishment in 1836 of the Delta Chapter of Alpha Delta Phi." - need source

The Philolexian Society is a literary and debating club founded in 1802, making it the oldest student group at Columbia, as well as the third oldest collegiate literary society in the country. It annually administers the Joyce Kilmer Bad Poetry Contest." - need source

The Columbia University Marching Band is one of Columbia's most notorious student group, due to both its penchant for edgy humor and its central role in campus traditions such as Orgo Night" - reference supplied supports Organic Chemistry night, but not the other claims.

There are a number of performing arts groups at Columbia dedicated to producing student theater, including the Columbia Players, King's Crown Shakespeare Troupe (KCST), Columbia Musical Theater Society (CMTS), NOMADS (New and Original Material Authored and Directed by Students), LateNite Theatre, Columbia University Performing Arts League (CUPAL), Black Theatre Ensemble (BTE), sketch comedy group Chowdah, and improvisational troupes Alfred and Fruit Paunch." - need sources

It is the oldest gay student organization in the world," - when making a broad claim like this, you need a reliable secondary source that would be in a position to know. The primary source given says founding was in 1967, but Columbia Wikipedia article says 1966.

C. No original research:
Legends, sports, history all have interesting material that goes beyond the sources provided.
Is it broad in its coverage?
A. Major aspects:
Explain how the orginal Columbia college Regents continued on to become the Regents of the University of the State of New York and supervisors of the NYS Dept. of Education. (Didn't think this was particularly relevant to the article seeing as the University was only under the auspices of the Regents for three years back in the 18th century; moreover, that would be something more appropriate for the History of Columbia University article considering the brevity that needs to be achieved with the history section in this article)

Was the University Press one of the early ones? I think that Cornell's was older. (The Press has it's own distinct article that addresses its history)

Organization needs more than list of colleges. Discuss the Board of Trustees - how many and how are they selected? Any student, faculty or alumni elected trustees?

Campus section should discuss sustainabilty.

Why are is the article clear as to whom Alfred Lerner Hall is named after, but you sluff off with Uris Hall. Why not wikilink to the donor? In this case Percy Uris. (Harold Uris, his brother went to Cornell.) Perhaps wikilink all of the buildings named after people with a Wikipedia article. (Actually thought it would be more appropriate not to talk about the individual halls in the article at this point. At some point in the near future I will begin work on a "Campus" article which can go into further depth about the Morningside Heights dorms. Again, I'm also trying to make the article more focused and shorter.)

I remember that when Cornell built its medical school dorm (Lasdon House), it had to prepare an Environmental Impact Statement. Are the building controveries described in the campus expansion section subject to an EIS requirement? Do they require approval by the NYC Board of Estimates? Please explain to the reader how the angry neighbors have leverage over the University's construction plans. (Better for the stand alone campus section.)

Perhaps expand each of the other campuses from a single sentence into a full paragraph. (Dido.)

B. Focused:
Article is very long. Consider WP:SPLITting off "History of Columbia University" as a separate article.

Is the Ahmadinejad visit worth a separate section and/or 2 paragraphs? Should this be a part of the history? (I think it is considering the long history of protests and student activism on the campus. The history section is overflowing with information enough as it is without trying to incorporate events such as these.)

In 1968 there was a major antiwar demonstration/building occupation at Columbia. But it is not covered in the history which focuses only on the gym construction. There were also antiwar protests after 1968. Student activism deserves more than just 3 sentences. (This is addressed in the Student Activism section and even has its own article.)

Barnard relationship needs more explanation - they take Columbia classes. (It's adressed in the last paragraph of the history section and at various points throughout the organization section of the article.)
Is it neutral?
Fair representation without bias:
ROTC ban" as a section heading is too-POV. How about "ROTC controversy" or "ROTC on campus"?

Columbia is home to two pioneers in undergraduate student broadcasting" - unsourced puffing that could be stated in a neutral way. (Restated as "early pioneers". I'm not sure if this was what you were looking for, but they really were both first in their field.)
Is it stable?
No edit wars, etc:
No edit wars.
Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
File:Young alexander hamilton.jpg - no reason to believe that this is the "work of the Federal Government." Use expired copyright template.

B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions: