Talk:Castlereagh (County Down townland)

Merger proposal

I would like to merge Castlereagh (County Down townland) and Castlereagh (County Down barony) into a new article titled Castlereagh, County Down, which only exists at the moment as a redirect to Castlereagh (disambiguation). A disambiguation note can also be added to the start of the article linking to the disambiguation page.

Reasons for proposed merger:

• Both articles are heavily related, seeing as the barony gets its names from the townland [1].
• Will create a more substantive article with greater scope for expansion.
• Will provide more notability.
• Similar articles that combine several heavily-related features already exist such as Iveagh, Lecale, and Ards (territory).
• Whilst Castlereagh borough council is also in County Down, it has its own title disambiguation Castlereagh (borough). Mabuska ^(talk) 14:42, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Oppose. The current assumption per WP:GEOLAND is that all inhabited townlands, being "Populated, legally recognized places" are sufficiently notable for their own articles. Changing that policy would require discussion at Wikipedia:WikiProject Ireland and Wikipedia:WikiProject Geography. The fact that two articles are short is often an argument for merging them, but not if that means overriding policy. Especially given integration with Wikidata, preserving the hierarchy of geographic units is sufficiently beneficial to outweigh the ugliness of having lots of short articles for not-particularly-interesting townlands. What do you merge townlands up to? Civil parish? DED? Ward? Better to keep them all separate. Merging a townland to a barony just because they happen to have the same name is a bad idea; baronies are a much higher level. Carlow is a town in a townland in an electoral division in a dispensary district in a rural district in a barony in a county, all called Carlow. jnestorius^(talk) 14:59, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Ah good point. In comparison to those other articles I pointed out above: Iveagh, Lecale, and Ards (territory), those were tuaths and other similar entities that formed the basis of the future baronies, whereas obviously Castlereagh barony is not based on the townland, though the castle (which the townland is named after) being the most principle one in the barony thus gave its name to it.

I withdraw the merge proposal then, however I suggest that Castlereagh, County Down (townland) and Castlereagh, County Down (barony) be used as the article namespaces as that is the standard procedure for disambiguation of land units and different types of which. I know there was a prior discussion and agreement on this issue but I can't for the life of me remember where and when it was. Mabuska ^(talk) 20:43, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Examples of places disambiguation by county include Dromore, County Down and Dromore, County Tyrone. These disambiguation articles Aughrim and Leitrim clearly have all the different locations of same name differentiated by comma not brackets, so it should be no brainer. The brackets apply for different types if needed. Mabuska ^(talk) 20:52, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

This should be brought up at Wikipedia:WikiProject Ireland. Current standards, inspecting Category:Townlands of Ireland, appear to be as follows:

1. Placename, County CountyName to distinguish from a place of the same name in a different county
2. Placename, BaronyName or Placename, ParishName to distinguish from a place of the same name in a different part of the same county (less standardisation of these at present than of #1)
3. Placename (townland) to disinguish from an enclosing unit of the same name

There does not seem to be any standard where #1 or #2 is combined with #3. (1) Placename, EnclosingUnit (townland) (2) Placename (EnclosingUnit townland) (3) Placename (townland, EnclosingUnit) are all plausible; it seems you favour the first and I the second. jnestorius^(talk) 12:05, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

See also Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ireland/Archive 12#Barony naming convention (2011) and Talk:List of baronies of Ireland#Titles of barony articles (2014) jnestorius^(talk) 12:12, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

There is no precedent anywhere in your argument for your preferred choice. Logic dictates that what I have said above and the thee points you provided above, that we follow (1). Mabuska ^(talk) 17:04, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

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