Draft talk:Eyes of Wakanda

Eyes of Wakanda

Are we sure Eyes of Wakanda is the same as the previously in-development untitled Wakanda series? Marvel says Eyes of Wakanda has not been previously announced and we never had any indication that this series would be animated. - adamstom97 (talk) 07:27, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Jeff Sneider previously reported on the Hot Mic podcast that there was an animated Wakanda series using the working title "The Golden City" (source - source 2), and that is the working title per Production Weekly and The Cosmic Circus, which also said it would be animated. Sneider also previously said that Coogler's Wakanda series and the Okoye one were the same. This feels like a similar case to Draft:Untitled Nova series where the listings got ahead of the trades but ended up lining up as the same thing. Trailblazer101 (talk) 07:34, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

I also felt our "untitled" one was meant to be the Okoye live action one, and Eyes is a completely new project. I think we should revert back to this version and start Eyes fresh, moving any relevant info (such as the production title) to the new article. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 17:24, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

In Deadline's exclusive, they call Coogler's series a drama, though Marvel's announcement just says will develop new television series, which includes one based in the Kingdom of Wakanda for Disney+. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 18:07, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Yes, Coogler is signed to develop multiple series set in Wakanda, the Variety cover story from November 2022 reaffirmed this, although I'm not convinced that Marvel would announce a new animated series for release next year out of the blue without any prior work being done and development being reported on. IGN believes this is the drama series, and notes the Okoye confirmation of it being that one, while Collider has further details on its premise which reaffirm it spans multiple times and explores T'Challa's ancestors. I still think it is safe to bundle all of this together in this draft as the reports and Marvel announcements have not directly contradicted each other, rather helped inform what this series could actually be. Trailblazer101 (talk) 18:16, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Ok. I think if we include some more of this commentary where we need it then we should be good. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 18:29, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Sounds good. I'll get right on it! Trailblazer101 (talk) 19:50, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

After going back to all of the prior sources, I do want to point out that not one of them said or gave an indication that the Wakanda / Okoye series was ever going to be live-action, despite that being the common presumption. The Total Film and ComicBook sources I've added in the article for commentary both state it was live-action, though this was never reported on or confirmed. Trailblazer101 (talk) 21:53, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

When Nate Moore was asked about the Okoye spinoff in November 2022 he said that the series wasn't far along in development and that they were still talking to Coogler about some ideas. I highly doubt he was referring to Eyes of Wakanda in that instance. With how long it takes to produce animation, if they were still juggling around ideas about it a year ago, it definitely wouldn't be releasing next year. He repeats that sentiment in April 2023 where he says they're still discussing ideas. This shows that at least by Nov 2022, or April 2023, a Okoye spinoff separate from EoW did exist.

Also, Deadline's May 2021 report on the Okoye spinoff is characterized in the draft as them being unsure about the situation but when I look at the exact wording in the article they sound pretty sure: "It would not come as a shock if Gurira also stars in the Wakanda series which Coogler is developing for Disney+. We first told you about the new show when the filmmaker and his Proximity Media signed a five-year overall exclusive TV deal with the studio." They differentiate the two by saying "also".

All this coupled with the other instances where Coogler was confirmed to be developing multiple series, it makes it seem like, at least in my eyes, that EoW and the Okoye spinoff are separate entities. Aldwiki1 (talk) 00:27, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

We cannot infer our own interpretation of what may have happened along the road, and we cannot simply ignore the reports from Jeff Sneider and Production Weekly which gave the working title for the animated series, which PW listed for the Wakanda series, and Sneider reported the Wakanda series and Okoye one were one and the same (which is also in the article). Some sources in the article for the recent reveal note whatever they were working on beforehand for the Okoye origin series may have just been retooled into this anthology animated series, hence the "could be" wording. After all, this being an anthology and partial prequel does not discount the Okoye origin being a part of it. They are not mutually exclusive, and no reports or statements have said this could not be true. Marvel tends to be tight-lipped on their projects in development, though the notion that an animated series on Wakanda is only being revealed for the first time equating to only starting work recently is not justification to say these are not the same. The ideas statements could have been for episodes or concepts, or even for what other series they could do, and they surely do not confirm that an Okoye series was separate from this animated one without violating WP:SYNTH. We are presenting all of the facts as we know them, and we cannot come to our own conclusions on this matter, or ignore other reports that are blatantly in this article as part of its development. Trailblazer101 (talk) 08:34, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Not to beat a WP:DEADHORSE but I just realized that Coogler's WGA profile lists him as an executive producer on an "Untitled Marvel Black Panther Danai Gurira Spinoff", and since WGA doesn't cover animation, it looks like a live-action series could still be in development. Could this be noted in the draft in any way? If not, then it's just something to keep in the mind for the future. Aldwiki1 (talk) 19:32, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I can add it along with the rest of the info, though if it truly was live-action, I doubt it would meet the 2023-24 television season timeframe that the WGA lists for it if it was a separate thing. Trailblazer101 (talk) 19:45, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I noticed that this article from Variety explicitly says Eyes of Wakanda is not the previously announced live-action series. - adamstom97 (talk) 20:25, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I don't think WGA dates are reliable indicators of a release timeframe. As we know from trades and the copyright filings; Ironheart, Born Again and Wonder Man are not going to release in the 2023-2024 TV season, but they're still listed as such on WGA. The dates also tend to change over time. For example, back in January 2022 Ironheart was listed for 2022-23 but right now it's 2023-24. Another example is Agatha being listed for 2021-22 back in February 2022, and now it's 2023-24. Echo was once listed for 2021-22 but it released in 2024. There are many examples of this. I think an estimated timeframe is given by the studios the first time projects are listed on WGA, but the dates are never final. I'm not saying we should never use them, just that in this specific case, it could be an outdated timeframe like the other examples.

I also believe this is definitely a live-action project because Marvel Studios' animated projects have never been covered by the WGA. Writers for What If, X-Men 97, YFNSM, Zombies and EoW don't have their respective projects listed on their WGA profiles. According to this, animated projects are not automatically covered by the WGA and writers need to negotiate for it. Deadline also notes that majority of animated projects are covered by a different union. Aldwiki1 (talk) 20:39, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

Ah, I see.... Then maybe we probably should split this. Trailblazer101 (talk) 21:15, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

Hey all, just catching, up. With the comments from above, I agree we should probably split this info back out to the untitled Wakanda series (centering on the Okoye info) and then keep Eyes of Wakanda. What ever happens, I think WP:HISTMERGEWP:HISTSPLIT might need to occur to some affect so the original draft history is preserved for the live action one, and then we move the Eyes info with that page. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 01:25, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

WP:HISTSPLIT has been requested. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 04:48, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for getting this arranged, Favre! Trailblazer101 (talk) 05:08, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

I have declined the history split request. While I do agree that there is a "before" and "after" version, there was nothing that one could consider a hard "split" or "hijack"; the change happened gradually over about a dozen edits (a paragraph here and there being changed at a time). I can't find a place to split that would make any sense from a history perspective. For what it's worth, there is nothing wrong with one draft being slowly converted into a similar article but on a slightly different topic; it's not like you went from an article about F1 to an article about show ponies. Primefac (talk) 19:32, 6 February 2024 (UTC)

Ok I think I've separated everything out and put attribution tags where needed. I've also worked through the Phase Seven draft, list of TV series, and Phase Five articles. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 01:27, 14 February 2024 (UTC)

Was the showrunner comment literal?

I know that, when Marc Bernardin revealed his work on the shpw, he said there was a showrunner involved. But Marvel Studios supposedly would start using showrunners from Born Again onwards. So, was he speaking figuratively or shpuld we assume the animated shows work differently?

I would also like to add that there's this tweet from Your Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man director Liza Singer crediting head writer Jeff Trammel's leadership on the show's quality when dorectors supposedly take the charge of MS shows once they start working on them, which suggests things are indeed different with Marvel Studios Amimation. BestDaysofMusic (talk) 23:53, 7 January 2024 (UTC)

While taking the Spidey info into account would by WP:Original research, there is nothing to suggest that Bernardin's usage of "showrunner" is inherently incorrect, as it has been used interchangeably with "head writer" in the past, though we ought to go by what the present sources provide us with. It is entirely plausible that someone like Todd Harris is the showrunner or head writer (DanielRPK apparently said Harris is the showrunner and an EP, though that can't be easily verified), we'll just need to wait-and-see on this, plus there is WP:NORUSH. I have included both "showrunner" and "head writer" terms hidden in the lead just in case. Trailblazer101 (talk) 04:34, 8 January 2024 (UTC)

Given the long lead time for animation, if it is Harris, he was likely the head writer at the time of hiring, which would be the correct term to use. How the media refers to him when the time comes will be another story. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 00:31, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

Matthew Chauncey also serving as a writer

According to his Instagram bio: https://www.instagram.com/matthewchauncey -TrixieCat123 (User talk:TrixieCat123) -TrixieCat123 (User talk:TrixieCat123) 22:56, 19 May 2024 (UTC)